Sean Payton is showing how fast you can turn teams around (3 Viewers)

[gavinj]

Jim Harbaugh swept his butt

 

[DavidM]

For the 1,000th time. It's not about kinder and gentler, it's about not acting like a 3 year-old and being a professional.

The way Rizzi tore into Hayball has been a blemish on his coaching performance for me, so far. I hope it was the exception, or maybe reflected something tailored to their relationship that was about pushing the right buttons. Holding players accountable is absolutely necessary, but that came across as unhinged and completely disproportionate to the circumstances and the mistake.

But there's another moment that I think has to also be considered, along with that one, that occurred in the last game. At a point during Haener's poor performance, there was a shot of him sitting on the bench, with Rizzi leaned in close, rubbing the back of his head, and seeming to offer some kind of encouragement.

By all accounts, he's very popular with the players and it seems unlikely that the heated moment with Hayball is something nobody had ever seen before.

 

[DavidM]

Not a chance I would want Saban anywhere near the Saints.....

1) he tried the NFL once, in Miami, and had full control (personnel included) it was a disaster, he lasted 2 seasons before bolting to Bama
2) he's 73......

Completely agree.

 

[saintfan-n-alexla]

Another question when it comes to talent evaluation over cap

Did SP sit silently by when we couldn’t sign or signed the wrong players on defense for the peak Brees years?

Or the drafting of PT and Dav

I would have a hard time believing he stood by and let those repeated mis-signings happen as well as bad DCs

And there is also luck / luck of Timing with Nix , ignoring the fact that 3/4 of a season is no guarantee of a successful career, SP never had the opportunity to draft a qb in top of the draft as he did with the anomaly that is Nix with possibly more college starts than any other qb.

I’m sure if we were able to make the Mahomes pick ( with AK in the 3rd everything else being equal) the story would be completely different

To our misfortune or bad timing out approx 10 pick is in a year with poor qbs compared to last season

Bottom line as I see it , Saints were bad for decades and in their best years in that span were avg at best on offense in that era , st our best we won with defense and FGs

The idea of “tanking” wasn’t a road the Saints wanted to go down IMO considering their history, hence the win now mode when it wasn’t a reality

imo we need to abandon the win next year expectations by adding FAs etc and build via draft which should include seriously considering trading down to build a roster with depth and not be upset with picking high next season

As fas as Carr , he isn’t the issue, probably not the answer and his contract isn’t the issue

Also with the injuries we have had this season winning would have been impossible despite the roster - that is the issue that worries me the most as it seems to be reoccurring over last few years (Pels too)

 

[St. Widge]

The way Rizzi tore into Hayball has been a blemish on his coaching performance for me, so far. I hope it was the exception, or maybe reflected something tailored to their relationship that was about pushing the right buttons. Holding players accountable is absolutely necessary, but that came across as unhinged and completely disproportionate to the circumstances and the mistake.

But there's another moment that I think has to also be considered, along with that one, that occurred in the last game. At a point during Haener's poor performance, there was a shot of him sitting on the bench, with Rizzi leaned in close, rubbing the back of his head, and seeming to offer some kind of encouragement.

By all accounts, he's very popular with the players and it seems unlikely that the heated moment with Hayball is something nobody had ever seen before.

I do think the players like and respect Rizzi which is certainly an advantage to him. And the incident with Hayball may have been a one time thing or just how they interact. So I do agree that it was over the top under the circumstances and I don't think it was something that means he can't or isn't a good HC. The Haener thing is clearly an example of him caring about his guys.

I however do think the contrast of the Haener situation and the Hayball situation gives me pause. Maybe it's just because Haener is a QB and confidence is more important for them. Or maybe its' because Hayball is thick skinned and/or needs to be yelled at and Haener is not think skinned or does not react well to being yelled at, but it does strike me as inconsistent treatment. Some of that is clearly necessary in managing different personality types, but I do think it can wear thin quickly if things aren't going great which in this situation means if the team isn't winning.

And I think overall, yelling at guys works fine at first, but in the long run guys tune it out if you do it too often or you don't win. Payton was certainly harsh at times, but most of the time he was pumping them up and I think spending all that time pumping them up made it more effective when he was yelling. And, of course, he won a lot of games so that gained him credibility.

I just find the idea that just because you don't think a coach should go all red faced and throw his headset down in a temper tantrum, it means you want a "soft" coach. There are many levels between red faced headset throwing and "soft". It just seems like fake macho bullshirt to me.

 

[Rexman100]

My buddy says he thinks that we will go after Nick Saban. Because Saban wants to accomplish something in the nfl. He seems like the SP type.

i dont know about the Saints, but i was watching Sabans interview from the other day, where he was complaining about how NIL is ruining CFB. And i thought to myself, this guy isnt done. I can see him going to the NFL. So normally id disagree with this post, but i wouldnt be shocked if he returned to the NFL. The power of waking up with nothing to do, will cause any man to seek a job. (there's not a more depressing feeling than being without purpose)

 

[DavidM]

I do think the player like and respect Rizzi which is certainly an advantage to him. And the incident with Hayball may have been a one time thing or just how they interact. So I do agree that it was over the top under the circumstances and I don't think it was something that means he can't or isn't a good HC. The Haener thing is clearly an example of him caring about his guys.

I however do think the contrast of the Haener situation and the Hayball situation gives me pause. Maybe it's just because Haener is a QB and confidence is more important for them. Or maybe its' because Hayball is thick skinned and/or needs to be yelled at and Haener is not think skinned or does not react well to being yelled at, but it does strike me as inconsistent treatment. Some of that is clearly necessary in managing different personality types, but I do think it can wear thin quickly if things aren't going great which in this situation means if the team isn't winning.

And I think overall, yelling at guys works fine at first, but in the long run guys tune it out if you do it too often or you don't win. Payton was certainly harsh at times, but most of the time he was pumping them up and I think spending all that time pumping them up made it more effective when he was yelling. And, of course, he won a lot of games so that gained him credibility.

I just find the idea that just because you don't think a coach should go all red faced and throw his headset down in a temper tantrum, it means you want a "soft" coach. There are many levels between red faced headset throwing and "soft". It just seems like fake macho bullshirt to me.

Yeah, I agree. It’s why the outburst raised some concern with me. Like you, it doesn’t mean I want a “soft” coach (that’s such a weird observation to me, anyway) but it’s understood that coaching can be a stressful job and that can take a serious toll.

Hopefully it’s not really any kind of big deal but it was alarming to see him completely lose his composure like that. Was it Mike Smith who would get redfaced and have meltdowns?

 

[Rexman100]

The way Rizzi tore into Hayball has been a blemish on his coaching performance for me, so far. I hope it was the exception, or maybe reflected something tailored to their relationship that was about pushing the right buttons. Holding players accountable is absolutely necessary, but that came across as unhinged and completely disproportionate to the circumstances and the mistake.

But there's another moment that I think has to also be considered, along with that one, that occurred in the last game. At a point during Haener's poor performance, there was a shot of him sitting on the bench, with Rizzi leaned in close, rubbing the back of his head, and seeming to offer some kind of encouragement.

By all accounts, he's very popular with the players and it seems unlikely that the heated moment with Hayball is something nobody had ever seen before.

Lutz drilled a 55 yard FG last night. And he did so, out of fear/respect. Just saying

 

[fishing4food]

SP, has done a great job. He beat every NFC South team this year for a combined 125-37 in points. I don't see the need to have any sour grapes over SP and the success he's having. He's a darn good coach and he is building up the Broncos fast.

 

[Grumpy Old Manatee]

Lutz drilled a 55 yard FG last night. And he did so, out of fear/respect. Just saying

Or, maybe, that’s just his job?

 

[gavinj]

SP, has done a great job. He beat every NFC South team this year for a combined 125-37 in points. I don't see the need to have any sour grapes over SP and the success he's having. He's a darn good coach and he is building up the Broncos fast.

That’s great and all but Jim Harbaugh and Dan Quinn deserve some credit too

It’s not like Sean Payton is the only capable coach out there

 

[DavidM]

Lutz drilled a 55 yard FG last night. And he did so, out of fear/respect. Just saying

Lutz was in a decline during the final three seasons with Payton here, enough so that it was a concern.

We had players make critical plays under Allen, who I’m not defending, just pointing out to better understand where you might be coming from.

 

[Rexman100]

Or, maybe, that’s just his job?

thats right, DO YOUR JOB, where have i heard that before

 

[St. Widge]

thats right, DO YOUR JOB, where have i heard that before

You really think Lutz hit a 55 yard field goal because he was afraid of Payton or because Payton told him to do his job?

Lots of kickers hit long field goals regardless if they have a good or bad coach. Grupe hit plenty long field goals under DA.

 

[Rexman100]

Lutz was in a decline during the final three seasons with Payton here, enough so that it was a concern.

We had players make critical plays under Allen, who I’m not defending, just pointing out to better understand where you might be coming from.

SP was harsh on Lutz and he even Lutz admitted that, that type of harsh coaching works for him. And the results back it up. (Otherwise Denver would've cut him by now, we no how impatient SP is w/ kickers) Hayball also has shown improvement since his shake down. Rizzi is simply pushing the right buttons, as per the player, is all. Rizzi was quite nice to JH after he was benched, he rubbed his head. Why didnt he light him up? (probably bc JH would've gone to pieces or mybe not) Then Rattler took over right after.