UnitedHealth CEO shot

[guidomerkinsrules]

Justice =/= Laws

So you’re allowing that someone can get justice outside of legal means?

 

[DaveXA]

So you’re allowing that someone can get justice outside of legal means?

No, I'm saying justice only properly functions within the confines of the law. Basically the laws governs justice. There's no legitimate justice outside the confines of the law. If the laws are bad, then justice becomes handcuffed by those bad laws. It's precisely why laws are amended and changed.

Want to fix the injustices by corporations? Change the laws so that they can be held accountable by the justice system.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

No, I'm saying justice only properly functions within the confines of the law. Basically the laws governs justice. There's no legitimate justice outside the confines of the law. If the laws are bad, then justice becomes handcuffed by those bad laws. It's precisely why laws are amended and changed.

Want to fix the injustices by corporations? Change the laws so that they can be held accountable by the justice system.

But again what if there isn’t a legitimate process to be able to change those laws
(I’m not asking ‘if’ there is a legitimate path to changing the laws, but ‘what if’ there isn’t?)

 

[DaveXA]

But again what if there isn’t a legitimate process to be able to change those laws
(I’m not asking ‘if’ there is a legitimate path to changing the laws, but ‘what if’ there isn’t?)

I don't know, anarchy? People can only take so much before they take matters into their own hands.

 

[Boy_of_wonder75]

I dunno. I gave you examples. If someone raped and kidnapped your wife, and you killed that person in retribution and I was on your jury you would get a not guilty from me.

Personally I would go to jail or die for my family.

If you killed someone who killed a member of your family, that member would still be dead. You're not killing their murderer for them, you're doing it for you. Just be up front with that.

 

[bigdaddysaints]

I tend to celebrate when someone stands up for others. Especially when you see so many people look away or take out there phone. When a kid is being bullied and someone steps in and beats the crap out of the bully I am all for it.

The guy in Texas who caught the guy raping his child and beat him to death. Good for him.

The guy who shot the pedophile in the airport for raping his son bravo.

Shooting a man in cold blood isn’t vigilante justice though.

so vigilante justice is OK as long as you agree with it. so where should the line be drawn? just what YOU think is OK? or should we have a vote of crimes that vigilante justice is ok for, put the crimes in ranking order and assign if vigilante justice is ok or not?
I think vigilante justice is bad, but i'm not gonna lie and say that i may be ok with some.
Think about how many people in the US were saying the guys who killed Ahmaud Arbery was justified. there are still many people who say his murderers were in the right, and they TRULY believe it in their hearts that what they did was the right thing.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

so vigilante justice is OK as long as you agree with it. so where should the line be drawn? just what YOU think is OK? or should we have a vote of crimes that vigilante justice is ok for, put the crimes in ranking order and assign if vigilante justice is ok or not?
I think vigilante justice is bad, but i'm not gonna lie and say that i may be ok with some.
Think about how many people in the US were saying the guys who killed Ahmaud Arbery was justified. there are still many people who say his murderers were in the right, and they TRULY believe it in their hearts that what they did was the right thing.

Would we all agree that our ‘justice’ system is supposed to hold people accountable for bad actions (and try to restore those who were hurt)?
But we have a system that ‘legally’ shields people from being held accountable (and many people even have to pay for being victimized)

so…we just take it?

 

[DaveXA]

Would we all agree that our ‘justice’ system is supposed to hold people accountable for bad actions (and try to restore those who were hurt)?
But we have a system that ‘legally’ shields people from being held accountable (and many people even have to pay for being victimized)

so…we just take it?

No one is arguing we should just take it. I mean, there have been demonstrations, riots, murders etc, etc yet the corps keep going on with business as usual because they have the politicians in their back pocket and nothing really changes.

Should we just take it? No. But our options are severely limited.

 

[CapitalCitySaint]

I tend to celebrate when someone stands up for others. Especially when you see so many people look away or take out there phone. When a kid is being bullied and someone steps in and beats the crap out of the bully I am all for it.

The guy in Texas who caught the guy raping his child and beat him to death. Good for him.

The guy who shot the pedophile in the airport for raping his son bravo.

Shooting a man in cold blood isn’t vigilante justice though.

the ruling class has taken away the working class’ only ways of pushing back/fighting back (legally), there’s little left to do. They bought the elections, they own the politicians from both major parties. They own the judges, the police. They tether our healthcare/life to our jobs to control us.

The problem with saying violence isn’t the answer is that violence is being perpetuated against all of us to some degree, every day but for some reason some of y’all are fine with that.

 

[CapitalCitySaint]

No one is arguing we should just take it. I mean, there have been demonstrations, riots, murders etc, etc yet the corps keep going on with business as usual because they have the politicians in their back pocket and nothing really changes.

Should we just take it? No. But our options are severely limited.

And that’s where the violence comes in. All these cries to humanize the ruling class are disgusting.

 

[CapitalCitySaint]

Well, I don't attribute corporations getting away with what they get away with is due to a lack of justice, but rather a lack of guardrails for those corporations. They get away with what they get away with because they're usually legally protected. If you want to change that, you have to change the laws governing them. The problem is less justice and more related to rules/laws allowing them to do what they do.

In short, the problem is political, not judicial.

Until the money from insurance companies to buy votes is done away with, nothing is going to change.

No, it’s both. The companies and rich guys own the politicians, judges and police.

 

[DaveXA]

No, it’s both. The companies and rich guys own the politicians, judges and police.

They may own a judge or few, but I don't buy that as a rule that they own most or even many. I think it's cynical to think otherwise.

Don't think they own the police at all. They don't really need to because their interests are already protected by the legal system to a large degree.

I agree with a lot of your sentiment, I'm just not buying that they own that much.

 

[Boy_of_wonder75]

They may own a judge or few, but I don't buy that as a rule that they own most or even many. I think it's cynical to think otherwise.

Don't think they own the police at all. They don't really need to because their interests are already protected by the legal system to a large degree.

I agree with a lot of your sentiment, I'm just not buying that they own that much.

No, the Proud Boys own the police.

 

[DaveXA]

And that’s where the violence comes in. All these cries to humanize the ruling class are disgusting.

Well, they are humans, no? Crummy ones, sure, but we largely don't know who the good ones are and aren't. What if someone is trying to work from within and is wrongly killed?

I think there are levers that can be used to affect change, but I'm not sure there's enough will of the people to actually make a dent right now. I don't have any good answers.