A microcosm of Winston’s career (1 Viewer)

[Rouxble]

If money weren’t a factor, and if he has a good enough grasp of the playbook, I’d agree with this.

Sadly, the first element is not true, and the second one likely isn’t either, so we probably do need to stick this thing out with Carr for a good bit longer and hope it all gets figured out, even if it means seeing what he can do under a different OC.

It’s one downfall of pro ball. At times, money will influence who plays more than performance. It’s pretty hard to bench a QB you just gave $70m guaranteed unless they are playing almost ridiculously bad.

 

[jahsoul357]

Obviously if Mahomes didn't have Andy Reid things probably not "come as easy" as they do for him but Mahomes has incredible pocket awareness and poise and everything and so it's a combination of his very unique abilities and scheme and all.

He has the ability but I've a believer in the scheme. When you look at what Reid put together, it's a beautiful thing but when you look at Mahomes interceptions, they come from those same plays that everyone salivates over. Those normally don't find their way to ESPN..lol. I'm not saying that Mahomes isn't playing his butt off but one thing that we never look at when truly evaluating a QB (especially when comparing to one's peers) is scheming.

 

[Brandon13]

He has the ability but I've a believer in the scheme. When you look at what Reid put together, it's a beautiful thing but when you look at Mahomes interceptions, they come from those same plays that everyone salivates over. Those normally don't find their way to ESPN..lol. I'm not saying that Mahomes isn't playing his butt off but one thing that we never look at when truly evaluating a QB (especially when comparing to one's peers) is scheming.

I think that's fair but Mahomes is the cheat code that unleashes the potential of Andy Reid's system. They were never going to reach these heights with Alex Smith.

 

[SoggyBottomBoy]

There was a point early on that we had Dobbs almost sacked which would've ended their drive. However, he was able to scramble and luckily convert the drive that led to a TD. At this point, we were screwed, for the first half, as they continued to pile on points. Around the 4th quarter Minns energy finally dissipated because they felt the game was over. The Saints rallied the troops in this brief window. Carr or JW could've been the general in this scenerio, not becasue they are so great, but because our D was finally able to get stops. And thats the fact being left out.

Can also point to Adebo nearly intercepting (should have) a pass on the Vikes first drive that instead turned into a 28 yard, fluke reception. Could have set a different tone for the game and Dobbs' confidence.

 

[jahsoul357]

I think that's fair but Mahomes is the cheat code that unleashes the potential of Andy Reid's system. They were never going to reach these heights with Alex Smith.

But we will never know. Something that isn't talking about much is Alex Smith got season 1 of Tyreek Hill as WR1, Mahomes got year 2 of Hill and we see how much of a game changer he really is. I mean, what would Mahomes do with Dwayne Bowe, Jason Avant and Avery? I'm not saying that he would do what Mahomes is doing but imagine if he actually had the green light to just go with both Kelce (who was the man before Mahomes) and that 2nd full season of Hill. I think they would have made a pretty deep run. I'm not saying 50 touchdowns but when you realize that they only won 2 more games in 2018 than 2017.

 

[Rexman100]

Can also point to Adebo nearly intercepting (should have) a pass on the Vikes first drive that instead turned into a 28 yard, fluke reception. Could have set a different tone for the game and Dobbs' confidence.

absolutely. I remember that vividly.

 

[Brandon13]

But we will never know. Something that isn't talking about much is Alex Smith got season 1 of Tyreek Hill as WR1, Mahomes got year 2 of Hill and we see how much of a game changer he really is. I mean, what would Mahomes do with Dwayne Bowe, Jason Avant and Avery? I'm not saying that he would do what Mahomes is doing but imagine if he actually had the green light to just go with both Kelce (who was the man before Mahomes) and that 2nd full season of Hill. I think they would have made a pretty deep run. I'm not saying 50 touchdowns but when you realize that they only won 2 more games in 2018 than 2017.

Again I think that's mostly fair but I also think it sort of sells short just how much impact Mahomes as a complete package brings to their offense.

Of course we'd have to enter an alternate reality to know but I simply do not believe that Mahomes is a mostly interchangeable talent at the quarterback position and that Reid could fairly easily find this same level of success with others. Reid is a great coach and so he will find ways to be successful but with Mahomes they found their perfect storm.

 

[St4ever]

Carr shined to you with that explosive 3 points right? Smh

All you see is three points! Buy conveniently you forget the drives that were stopped by stupid penalties and dropped passes. People want to keep saying Winston brought us back from the 24-3 butt whipping we were getting when all he really did was have two good drives in over a quarter and a half! while making the game more exciting to watch it still did not get us there. Only teased us into thinking we had a chance. I don’t knock JW for his athletic skills only his lack of cerebral trustworthiness!

 

[DSnfla]

Deuce Windham had a pretty good breakdown of Jameis's play and he pointed out something a lot of people have missed. It's not that Jameis is bad at pre-snap reads; it's that he is bad at adjusting when the look changes post-snap. Another weakness is that he trusts his receivers to make the play, no matter what. That TD to Olave was insane. Probably the best TD pass a Saints QB has thrown since Drew retired. The second one was a God's Plan throw that he trusted AT to come down with.

Wanna get depressed about the defense again? Sheldon Rankins had three sacks against the Bungles.

Duece Windham , another " I took a Class Guy" so now I'm qualified to give expert (LOL) advice on youtube

 

[DSnfla]

He also threw 2 unforced interceptions. There's always good/bad with Winston. It's the story of most of his career. He needs a Payton who can get the most out of him and minimize the down sides. I'm not seeing the current coaching staff doing that.

And should have been a 3rd

 

[Brandon13]

All you see is three points! Buy conveniently you forget the drives that were stopped by stupid penalties and dropped passes. People want to keep saying Winston brought us back from the 24-3 butt whipping we were getting when all he really did was have two good drives in over a quarter and a half! while making the game more exciting to watch it still did not get us there. Only teased us into thinking we had a chance. I don’t knock JW for his athletic skills only his lack of cerebral trustworthiness!

You have to give Jameis credit for the plays he made and for doing his part in giving us an opportunity just like it's fine to assign blame for the poor decision he made in throwing that interception into triple coverage.

The offense struggling with Carr certainly was not all Carr's fault but he also wasn't "good" and his play is subject to fair criticism as well.

The horrific defensive performance we had in the first half screwed us more than anything however imo. Freaking God awful.

 

[Jesse Custer]

The horrific defensive performance we had in the first half screwed us more than anything however imo. Freaking God awful.

Feedback loop. Defense couldn't stop Hockensen and the offense couldn't sustain a drive. Hero ball was the only way to dig out. Almost pulled it off, too. Just got a little too Rex Grossman-y towards the end.

 

[SWJJ]

I think that's fair but Mahomes is the cheat code that unleashes the potential of Andy Reid's system. They were never going to reach these heights with Alex Smith.

The Chiefs were a top 5 offense in 2017 with Alex Smith. Smith had like over 4K yards passing with 26 TDs and only 5 interceptions.


His record was 50-26 as the Chief's Starter. I always felt like he was grossly underappreciated in the NFL.

He obviously was never the same player after the leg broke in 2018, and it's a miracle he even survived and still has the leg.

 

[Brandon13]

The Chiefs were a top 5 offense in 2017 with Alex Smith. Smith had like over 4K yards passing with 26 TDs and only 5 interceptions.


His record was 50-26 as the Chief's Starter. I always felt like he was grossly underappreciated in the NFL.

He obviously was never the same player after the leg broke in 2018, and it's a miracle he even survived and still has the leg.

Yeah I wasn't attempting to denigrate Alex Smith, I really liked Alex Smith and the strides he made from his early days in San Francisco were impressive.

If people do not believe that Mahomes is a special player they are within their right to feel that way but I'll just say I disagree I guess and leave it at that.

 

[SWJJ]

Yeah I wasn't attempting to denigrate Alex Smith, I really liked Alex Smith and the strides he made from his early days in San Francisco were impressive.

If people do not believe that Mahomes is a special player they are within their right to feel that way but I'll just say I disagree I guess and leave it at that.

I didn't take it that way, just every time someone talks about Alex Smith I feel obligated to talk about how great and unappreciated his 2017 season was and how he was playing the best football of his life when the leg was broken.

Mahomes is the best QB in the NFL right now, and has been top 5 since he got in the league.

Generational player doing things no one else can do.