Aside from DA is anyone really happy with Kubiak's play calling? (1 Viewer)

[Nolan]

Allen isn't calling the offense. Kubiak is. Stop top making excuses for Kubiak.

What are you talking about? When did I suggest otherwise?

I said he's young and green and he doesn't have a head coach that holds hold him accountable or that is capable of making him better.

I have no allegiance to the dude. He can leave with Allen.

 

[SystemShock]

You're judging him based on an largely incomplete roster. And by a HC who is a poor leader. KK is in a no win situation here. They haven't had anything close to a reasonably healthy offense since week 2.

Also, if players don't execute the plays called...

I am judging on watching Kamara run through the middle for no yards and the sweep to the short side for no yards plays we see over, and over, and over again. I'm judging him on putting Rattler under center rather than on shotgun. I'm judging him on not modifying the protection.

He's as guilty as Allen. Allen has an incomplete roster too.

 

[BoNcHiE]

The game plan yesterday was to run the ball effectively, dominate TOP, not turn the ball over, and win a 23-10 type game.

That was the gameplan because Carr was coming back from injury and we were down to one NFL-caliber WR (who then got hurt and left the game).

We succeeded in that, running for 200 yards, dominating TOP, not turning the ball over, and scoring 22 points. It would have been more had Allen not been an absolute coward on two 4th down plays. That should have been enough to win against Bryce Young and a Panthers team that only gained 250 yards of offense the entire game. But with Dennis Allen at the head, nothing is ever enough to win.

That's just yesterday, though. Was Kubiak's playcalling good enough prior? I have no idea because with all the injuries, it was impossible to tell what was real and what wasn't.

 

[Cajun Mike]

Do I dare say this offense is worse than Carmichaels. Either way I see no creativity with it. I mean at least try to fool defenses.

Totally don’t agree, too many injuries.

 

[Infoman]

I am judging on watching Kamara run through the middle for no yards and the sweep to the short side for no yards plays we see over, and over, and over again. I'm judging him on putting Rattler under center rather than on shotgun. I'm judging him on not modifying the protection.

He's as guilty as Allen. Allen has an incomplete roster too.

To be fair... Kamara's "run through the middle and the sweep to the short side" has been the only thing that's worked since week 2...

The thing that allowed the offense operate at a high level the first 2 weeks was (the then healthy) OLine dominating in the run game... with play action passes to the intermediate and deep areas off of that... which worked great when we had time to throw and 2 legit healthy deep threats....

From then on... the line took a big hit... opposing defenses decided to double Shaheed and be physical with Chris... then both guys got hurt too... and that was a wrap.

We could have somewhat survived on offense with a mediocre Oline, and even a backup QB for a few games...

But we never had enough weapons to start the season on offense at WR, TE, or RB for Kubiak survive one or two injures at those spots.... His offense is based on them and their ability to create problems with the opposing defenses' "eye discipline"...

We also have/had zero physical presence at TE or WR... and never addressed that either.

In short, this offense (just like the 49ers offense) was always a few skill position injures away from where we are now....

 

[dtc]

I am judging on watching Kamara run through the middle for no yards and the sweep to the short side for no yards plays we see over, and over, and over again. I'm judging him on putting Rattler under center rather than on shotgun. I'm judging him on not modifying the protection.

He's as guilty as Allen. Allen has an incomplete roster too.

We ran for 200 yards yesterday with a QB who everyone knows has less arm currently than Brees in his last year.

They knew we were running and couldn't stop it.

That sissy penalty on Penning, sissy call on 4th and 1, the no timeout and then, ultimately, DDs penalty in the red zone are the difference between a win with half a team and this.

FYI

 

[SystemShock]

The game plan yesterday was to run the ball effectively, dominate TOP, and win a 23-10 type game.

That was the gameplan because Carr was coming back from injury and we were down to one NFL-caliber WR (who then got hurt and left the game).

We succeeded in that, running for 200 yards, dominating TOP, and scoring 22 points. It would have been more had Allen no been an absolute coward on two 4th down plays. That should have been enough to win. But with Dennis Allen at the head, nothing is ever enough to win.

That's just yesterday, though. Was Kubiak's playcalling good enough prior? I have no idea because with all the injuries, it was impossible to tell what was real and what wasn't.

... or if instead of FGs in the red zone, the Saints score TDs. But hey, let's call Allen names.

And for the record, I am not defending Allen. I am putting Kubiak on the same boat as Allen. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. You don't drop from scoring 40+ points in 2 games to scoring 10 just because your center went down. You score 40+ because you play against really bad defenses.

Kubiak kind of reminds me of Bridgewater. TB won a few games, and he became a legend around this parts. Kubiak's offense dropped 2 40 burgers against really bad defenses, and now some are protecting him.

 

[BreesusSaves]

To be fair... Kamara's "run through the middle and the sweep to the short side" has been the only thing that's worked since week 2...

The thing that made the offense work the first 2 weeks was (the then healthy) OLine dominating in the run game... with play action passes to the intermediate and deep areas off of that... which worked great when we had time to throw and 2 legit healthy deep threats....

From then on... the line took a big hit... opposing defenses decided to double Shaheed and be physical with Chris... then both guys got hurt too... and that was a wrap.

We could have somewhat survived on offense with a mediocre Oline, and even a backup QB for a few games...

But we never had enough weapons to start the season on offense at WR, TE, or RB for Kubiak survive one or two injures at those spots.... His offense is based on them and their ability to create problems with the opposing defenses' "eye discipline"...

We also have/had zero physical presence at TE or WR... and never addressed that either.

In short, this offense (just like the 49ers offense) was always a few skill position injures away from where we are now....

Having to rely on the Center to call the protections and blocking schemes and then losing said Center is also a crippling blow. I fully understand not every QB is Brees, Brady, or Manning, but for the amount of cap even tier 3 QBs are now consuming, it feels insulting when a QB getting an AAV of $37.5m a year can't handle those calls.

 

[saintsmarchin]

It always seems to be a handcuff situation when it comes to something we are going to be good at.

Any eligible backfield player who changes his stance does not have to come to a complete stop prior to the snap, as long as his actions are not abrupt (false start) or forward (illegal motion)

this change hurt the potential, but it was injuries that cost us early. You can't PA at all now because no one respects the receivers.. we were already missing a 3rd WR.

Without Shaheed you can put a fork in it.. no one is scared of the pass and even if Mccoy comes back and the line can open the holes.. its not going to translate.

Nothing really wrong with his playcalling. First two weeks were so crisp and pristine.. then the wheels came off.. and got even worse as time went on.

I liken it to Spags.. he didnt have sheet for tools when he came here.. now his defenses at KC are just nasty.

Same could be said about our defense.. it's old... way to old.

Klint entered the year with great tools.. enough for him to make his offense be deveststing.. now he's down to nothing...

tbh he should be interim and we should further on the offense going into next year... because the defense has dropped off and will only further get worse.


(It's going to be a couple years before the offense becomes a finely tooled machine.. and the defense will fall apart.. build offense to be young and strong then bring in a good DC and players on defense.. and that's how we revamp).

 

[Big_L]

I'm really down on this offense. If just doesn't make sense to me and he doesn't seem to make any adjustments when necessary.
I know we have a lot of injuries but we can't seem to run an NFL offense. Any agree'ers?

I'm still willing to give Kubiak the benefit of the doubt over Allen.

 

[BoNcHiE]

... or if instead of FGs in the red zone, the Saints score TDs. But hey, let's call Allen names.

And for the record, I am not defending Allen. I am putting Kubiak on the same boat as Allen. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. You don't drop from scoring 40+ points in 2 games to scoring 10 just because your center went down. You score 40+ because you play against really bad defenses.

Kubiak kind of reminds me of Bridgewater. TB won a few games, and he became a legend around this parts. Kubiak's offense dropped 2 40 burgers against really bad defenses, and now some are protecting him.

Your bias in framing and omission of relevant details is as bad as what you are accusing others of.

 

[DaveXA]

I am judging on watching Kamara run through the middle for no yards and the sweep to the short side for no yards plays we see over, and over, and over again. I'm judging him on putting Rattler under center rather than on shotgun. I'm judging him on not modifying the protection.

He's as guilty as Allen. Allen has an incomplete roster too.

Eh, Allen is the HC and it starts with him. Until that changes, I'm not gonna point fingers at the OC in his first season with the team.

Regardless, the offense did mostly what they were supposed to, but for a few baffling key plays that were more Allen making poor decisions than anything else.

We need a competent HC in order to judge KK fairly, not to mention a somewhat healthy offense. Like I stated, it's incomplete without having all of the tools he needs to be successful.

We can disagree, but that's where I'm at with KK. I want a young coach who can learn the ropes and grow into the role. KK isn't there yet, but I definitely think he can. Not with Allen though.

 

[DaveXA]

... or if instead of FGs in the red zone, the Saints score TDs. But hey, let's call Allen names.

And for the record, I am not defending Allen. I am putting Kubiak on the same boat as Allen. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. You don't drop from scoring 40+ points in 2 games to scoring 10 just because your center went down. You score 40+ because you play against really bad defenses.

Kubiak kind of reminds me of Bridgewater. TB won a few games, and he became a legend around this parts. Kubiak's offense dropped 2 40 burgers against really bad defenses, and now some are protecting him.

It wasn't just because the center (even if that's the most significant)went down, but keep going with that if that works for you.

 

[Elvis]

He isn’t inexperienced as he has had two other stints before and it appears not much has been learned. Anyone else without the name of Kubiak and he wouldn’t be thought so highly of…Just because someone has had experience doing something doesn’t mean he is the right person.

So after four pages of posts a quick recap:
1. KK needs every player healthy to be successful at calling plays. On top of that, he needs Pro-Bowl talent as well…If not, then he he obviously gets a pass.

2. It’s the penalties that hold back his play calling.

Reality - he doesn’t know how to make in game adjustments and doesn’t call plays that maximize the skill sets of the players being fielded.

Who cares about empty yards, the name of the game is to put points on the board and the plays he called in red zone were putrid.

DA chose poorly like many of the coaches he has chosen under his “leadership.”

He had a year with the Vikings calling his dads offense after he retired and took over play calling late in the season on a failing Broncos team. Those weren’t his offenses that he set up from scratch. In both instances he was just like DA, taking over something someone else built. This is his first real from scratch OC job. He IS inexperienced at this job. Not NO experience, but very little.

 

[TLand11]

My biggest worry this off season was that we wouldn't see Kubiak's offense because of DA holding the reins. I think we saw Kubiak's offense for 2 games. What we're seeing now is DA choking the reins.

Exactly, can't have the offense outshine Dennis' defense, can we?

My biggest worry this off season was that we wouldn't see Kubiak's offense because of DA holding the reins. I think we saw Kubiak's offense for 2 games. What we're seeing now is DA choking the reins.