Here’s what I don’t get re Saints ranking predictions (2 Viewers)

[Ken-Bob]

This may seem counter to another post I just wrote, but I actually do see them about the same - but there are definitely some wild cards. The offense could be drastically improved, but that's a big "could be". It would be great if that happened, but it's rare that a team just starts hitting on all cylinders that quickly. And Carr is talking a good game but that's all it is just yet -- talk. I think most of us feel that QB means more to a team than any other position and I'm hesitant to believe that Carr just takes some huge leap because of a new coach and scheme. I really think they will get hit pretty hard out of the gate, then be fighting to catch up the rest of the season. See Mike D's game by game analysis - I think he's pretty spot on - but he's actually giving them a game or two that I might not.

 

[evilsaint]

I think you are missing the bigger point.....A HC's leadership ability is incredibly important, I think that is at the crux of the offseason predictions.....and while I think it's silly at this point in time for predictions at the same time, to me, this is a firm indictment of DA's ability as a HC....

I'm not happy DA is still here as the HC, I mean it took 2 full years of offensive failures to replace an OC that had to be convinced to take the job in the first place...... thus far I believe DA has shown to be an incompetent leader.....but sometimes things do change, never say never....I find comfort in being wrong more often than I'd like and I hope this is the case with DA......

Not trying to be snarky, legit curious. Did you have this same energy when SP was wallowing in defensive ineptitude and wasting one of the greatest quarterbacks of our era on 7-9?

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

I think you are missing the bigger point.........

I’m not

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

This may seem counter to another post I just wrote, but I actually do see them about the same - but there are definitely some wild cards. The offense could be drastically improved, but that's a big "could be". It would be great if that happened, but it's rare that a team just starts hitting on all cylinders that quickly. And Carr is talking a good game but that's all it is just yet -- talk. I think most of us feel that QB means more to a team than any other position and I'm hesitant to believe that Carr just takes some huge leap because of a new coach and scheme. I really think they will get hit pretty hard out of the gate, then be fighting to catch up the rest of the season. See Mike D's game by game analysis - I think he's pretty spot on - but he's actually giving them a game or two that I might not.

That’s fair
In OP I explained that I can understand the argument for repeating last year - I can also see the changes/additions adding a game or few to our win total
What I didn’t get were the predictions that we’d be worse
Obviously it’s possible- it’s the nfl after all
But I still don’t see a sound argument for us getting worse
(And I’m growing more and more confident in my ‘DA hate’ guess)

 

[Artifactual]

I saw on OTB where TBob said that to this point the Saints were the team with the least amount of bets placed on them winning the SB in 2024.

That's not to say the Saints have the worst odds to win the SB in 2024 but the bettors to this point have the least confidence in the Saints doing so regardless of odds.

 

[fanoftheyear7]

I assume you’ll agree that he’s a good (perhaps even great DC)
But he falls short as an HC
Do you disagree with the Kubiak signing?
It seems like DC/ML recognized the issue at OC and went and got their guy
Or do you see it differently?

I think he’s a great coordinator. He seems like an even more genuinely nice guy. I don’t think people get the extra responsibility required to be the Head guy. It’s not easy. Across the landscape of the nfl for years you see coordinators get promoted a fired all the time. I mean they all hot the job to begin with because they were really good coordinators. But yes, he doesn’t seem to be built to take the next step. I love the Kubiak hiring but I more of a wait and see approach. I’ve just never in NFL history seen a really good coordinator elevate a borderline terrible head coach. Closest thing I can even think of may be buddy Ryan with the Bears but even that was for 1 season.

 

[Brandon13]

I saw on OTB where TBob said that to this point the Saints were the team with the least amount of bets placed on them winning the SB in 2024.

That's not to say the Saints have the worst odds to win the SB in 2024 but the bettors to this point have the least confidence in the Saints doing so regardless of odds.

Maybe but I don't think it's quite as clear-cut as that.. if our odds were worse, AKA a better payout on the bet if we were to win it.. more people might be willing to take a chance on putting a few bucks on us.

As is I would imagine there are quite a few small bets placed on the teams a tier down from us in the odds heading into the season, with the idea being that if you're going to place a bet on a bad team anyway (as that's pretty much the general public's perception of what we'll be), you might as well roll the dice on a team that will give you a better payout.

 

[RebSaint]

This may seem counter to another post I just wrote, but I actually do see them about the same - but there are definitely some wild cards. The offense could be drastically improved, but that's a big "could be". It would be great if that happened, but it's rare that a team just starts hitting on all cylinders that quickly. And Carr is talking a good game but that's all it is just yet -- talk. I think most of us feel that QB means more to a team than any other position and I'm hesitant to believe that Carr just takes some huge leap because of a new coach and scheme. I really think they will get hit pretty hard out of the gate, then be fighting to catch up the rest of the season. See Mike D's game by game analysis - I think he's pretty spot on - but he's actually giving them a game or two that I might not.

I can understand the outside press and commentators, talking heads, podcasters not being bullish on the Saints.

In addition to questions about DA, consider the following: There are multiple positions and position groups whereby the fans are counting on players improving their performance or regaining prior form from injury or just being young and learning to improve and play better. The Saints have a ton of young talent who seems to be either on the ascension, or struggling to break out and some vets who have suffered from injuries or just poor coaching (I'm thinking of Kamara and Miller, here especially)

As KB, has stated "could be" seems to define a lot of what is driving the confidence and hope or this team. "Could be" exists pretty much an all position groups, maybe besides the defensive backfield. And then there are injuries; this team doesn't have much depth anywhere, but other teams don't either, so the Saints will have to just be lucky and not get hit with the injury bug too much.

The most significant improvement that *must* happen is on both lines: if our offensive and defensive lines improves, I think Carr will get better, KK will have an easier time game-planning and calling plays, etc. But guys like Cameron Jordan, Alvin Kamara, A.T. Perry, Trevor Penning, Fuaga, Turner, Young, Fiosky, etc. need to step up and show out.

And then there's coaching: I think KK and his offensive staff will be beneficial, but the question is will it be enough to get to 10-12 wins? Sorry, I don't see it. I see the ceiling is 9 wins and the floor around 6 wins.

I'm hoping for the "could be" to happen with most players, but most teams ready to win 10-13 games are more do not have a bunch of "could bes" on their team.

 

[evilsaint]

I can understand the outside press and commentators, talking heads, podcasters not being bullish on the Saints.

In addition to questions about DA, consider the following: There are multiple positions and position groups whereby the fans are counting on players improving their performance or regaining prior form from injury or just being young and learning to improve and play better. The Saints have a ton of young talent who seems to be either on the ascension, or struggling to break out and some vets who have suffered from injuries or just poor coaching (I'm thinking of Kamara and Miller, here especially)

As KB, has stated "could be" seems to define a lot of what is driving the confidence and hope or this team. "Could be" exists pretty much an all position groups, maybe besides the defensive backfield. And then there are injuries; this team doesn't have much depth anywhere, but other teams don't either, so the Saints will have to just be lucky and not get hit with the injury bug too much.

The most significant improvement that *must* happen is on both lines: if our offensive and defensive lines improves, I think Carr will get better, KK will have an easier time game-planning and calling plays, etc. But guys like Cameron Jordan, Alvin Kamara, A.T. Perry, Trevor Penning, Fuaga, Turner, Young, Fiosky, etc. need to step up and show out.

And then there's coaching: I think KK and his offensive staff will be beneficial, but the question is will it be enough to get to 10-12 wins? Sorry, I don't see it. I see the ceiling is 9 wins and the floor around 6 wins.

I'm hoping for the "could be" to happen with most players, but most teams ready to win 10-13 games are more do not have a bunch of "could bes" on their team.

Just for "scale", how many "could bes" did we have in the 08 offseason?

 

[los226]

Only Saints fans think this team has gotten better. What talent upgrades have been made this offseason? The Saints were not a mega talented team last year. The offensive coaching staff changes will be enough to improve the offense, but I still see the same W/L outcome.

The Saints had a historically easy schedule last year and couldn’t get it done. That was truly pathetic that they let Baker and the Bucs win the division.

 

[Craig Walker]

I think it's the mindset that the Falcons improved the most by actually having a QB this year. Most are picking us for 3rd in the division.

The "just above .500 win %" guy? Kirk is a stats guy only.

 

[Craig Walker]

The Saints will surprise people this year.

 

[44slayer]

Im going to be as non homer as I can on this. I still think Dennis Allen is public enemy #1 with this franchise, but I wont even factor it in going forward.....

I dont see how we are better or worse personnel wise. We lost Ram and Peat. We gained Fuaga and somehow, in ways ill never understand, Penning is a preseason all pro at RT around here. The same guy who was passed over for guys signed mid week last year.

We didnt improve at RB, TE or WR. But AT Perry is going to be the next Michael Thomas. Again, Michael Thomas, pre injuries, was elite. AT Perry had TWELVE catches last year. The 'buzz' about AT Perry should be tampered down a bit because we recently had an UDFA flash in year 1, and he was going to be the next great NO WR - and mostly fell on his face in Marquez Callaway.

Carr is going to be what he has been for 10 years. Average. We can circle back to AT Perry here. Brees could make AT Perry better than you might think. Brees elevated guys around him. Carr is not that guy. Carr relies on guys to make him better, not the other way around like Brees. And sure, theres only 1 Brees. But Carr does not have that trait in him to project UDFAs like AT Perry becoming stars in the NFL.

We signed a DE, then he had neck surgery the week after. The defense is largely the same, just older. And we were already old.

Otherwise we had a decent draft with the picks we had. The offense SHOULD be better from a playcalling standpoint. But the o line is going to dictate a lot in that. The offensive staff seems like it was a good move.

Flip side, this schedule is much tougher than last years. Last year we played 4 upper half (zero elite) quarterbacks and we were 0-4 against them. This year we play Mahomes, Herbert, Cousins, Cousins, Dak, Hurts, Watson, Love, Stafford and we will get the Sean Payton Bowl and we always seem to make rookie qbs hall of famers right out the gate - so we play Jayden Daniels and Bo Nix.

So a largely unchanged team that went 9-8 against a far easier schedule, with a new offensive staff. If we win 9, itll be far more impressive than last years 9 wins. I think we are a 6-9 win team.

 

[sfidc3]

Not trying to be snarky, legit curious. Did you have this same energy when SP was wallowing in defensive ineptitude and wasting one of the greatest quarterbacks of our era on 7-9?

Would that be the same coach of the Saints that by that time had multiple playoff appearances, had already gone to 2 NFC championship games, won a SB, etc?

Legit curious? Hardly, it's the same old tired trope of pointing out the fact that CSP wasn't perfect but somehow that makes DA look.....better.....it doesn't.....it just makes folks look foolish when they make that argument...

The plain fact is DA has never taken a team to the playoffs in 6 years and has an overall record of .343.....so no, I guess I didn't have the same "energy" because there really is no comparing a coach who has already proven they can win a championship and one who has yet to even make the playoffs (even after a season with a very favorable schedule in the NFL's worst division).....

 

[44slayer]

Not trying to be snarky, legit curious. Did you have this same energy when SP was wallowing in defensive ineptitude and wasting one of the greatest quarterbacks of our era on 7-9?

Youre legit curious why we have a problem with a guy and his .343 career win %, 0 playoff appearances, who has looked like he was in over his head during all 5 years as a head coach in comparison to a head coach, who by his 5th year was 49-31, had a .613 win %, 6 playoff game appearances, 2 NFCCGs and a Super Bowl?

Who also averaged 12 wins in the 4 seasons before AND the 4 seasons after that 7-9 stretch.

Youre legit curious about that?