Jarvis Landry visiting Saints tomorrow (1 Viewer)

[sfidc3]

Correct me if I’m wrong but wasn’t the reason Armstead fell was due to where he went to school

Yep, both he and Jahri Evans (another later round pick) went to small schools....worked out pretty well....Ram will go down as one of Ireland's best BPA selections ever....

And, if they don't want to open it up and take shots down field, then they need to go get another QB now. Trying to fit Winston into a low volume running game oriented offense just doesn't make sense. It's square peg in round hole stuff.

I'm gonna disagree a bit here.....to achieve good offensive balance I want the running game to be at about the same volume as the passing game....that doesn't mean we aren't taking shots, it just means our running game is setting up those (play action) shots...

 

[COACHTDL]

The problem with recruitment is that this is a low volume passing offense. Winston had training wheels on last year and completed 15 passes per game. If Thomas averages 7-8 catches per game, how much will be left? I’m sure the Saints will pass more, but I doubt the Saints deviate away from focusing on efficiency. If Landry is looking to put up big numbers for a better contract, his chances will probably be limited here.

I would take last years offensive change with a grain of salt. There were no real experienced recievers to start the year. Then the offensive line went to hell. They will definitely pass more with higher quality, more experienced recievers as long as oline stays healthy. (After picking oline in first round.)

 

[St. Widge]

Yep, both he and Jahri Evans (another later round pick) went to small schools....worked out pretty well....Ram will go down as one of Ireland's best BPA selections ever....



I'm gonna disagree a bit here.....to achieve good offensive balance I want the running game to be at about the same volume as the passing game....that doesn't mean we aren't taking shots, it just means our running game is setting up those (play action) shots...

Yeah, I don't mean that we shouldn't run the ball, and Winston is actually very good at play action, I'm just saying that the offense was really conservative last year. They were running the ball regardless of if it was effective or not and you can't win in the NFL like that anymore.

And, I don't think the idea of 50/50 run pass balance really works in the NFL anymore. It's nearly impossible to run now when teams know you are going to run. Offenses need to be more multiple and use the short passing game to get the LBs and Safties to back off the LOS in order to run the ball effectively. I suspect the offense will look much more like the 2011 era offense going forward if we can get the OL fixed and add some weapons. I think that, maybe with more play action and bit more running, is the future for this offense. Otherwise, why would you keep Pete Carmichael instead of looking for someone that schemes a more run oriented attack?

 

[COsaintsfan]

We need him for depth at the very least but 4 or 5 catches a game can't be very appeasing.

How could you not be thrilled with Landry as a Saint?
We all know the salary cap is made up as long as you have an owner willing to shell out tons of cash upfront.

 

[sammymvpknight]

I would take last years offensive change with a grain of salt. There were no real experienced recievers to start the year. Then the offensive line went to hell. They will definitely pass more with higher quality, more experienced recievers as long as oline stays healthy. (After picking oline in first round.)

The biggest question in my mind is whether the Saints need to pass. There will be games I’m sure they will but I’d be surprised if we aren’t in the bottom third of pass attempts…and you have Thomas and Kamara that are destined to probably get half of that production, if not more. You still have Callaway and Harris, who I still believe will have their roles (though more limited) and likely a rookie WR contributor. Even if volume goes up…I’m doubtful that you’ll see Landry come close to approaching 1000 yards. I wouldn’t come close to him in fantasy. I still think he would be a really valuable addition, but I would understand if he chose a higher volume situation.

 

[sfidc3]

Yeah, I don't mean that we shouldn't run the ball, and Winston is actually very good at play action, I'm just saying that the offense was really conservative last year. They were running the ball regardless of if it was effective or not and you can't win in the NFL like that anymore.

And, I don't think the idea of 50/50 run pass balance really works in the NFL anymore. It's nearly impossible to run now when teams know you are going to run. Offenses need to be more multiple and use the short passing game to get the LBs and Safties to back off the LOS in order to run the ball effectively. I suspect the offense will look much more like the 2011 era offense going forward if we can get the OL fixed and add some weapons. I think that, maybe with more play action and bit more running, is the future for this offense. Otherwise, why would you keep Pete Carmichael instead of looking for someone that schemes a more run oriented attack?

I think it works fine....in 2020 during our 9 game winning streak we actually ran the ball more than we threw it.....I think it comes down to our offensive line being a better run blocking line and it's more a case of playing to our strengths but I also know this is not a popular sentiment among Saints fans....and it really doesn't matter who is playing QB, be it Brees, Taysom, Teddy.....we have been run first or at least run often for a few years now....

 

[St. Widge]

The biggest question in my mind is whether the Saints need to pass. There will be games I’m sure they will but I’d be surprised if we aren’t in the bottom third of pass attempts…and you have Thomas and Kamara that are destined to probably get half of that production, if not more. You still have Callaway and Harris, who I still believe will have their roles (though more limited) and likely a rookie WR contributor. Even if volume goes up…I’m doubtful that you’ll see Landry come close to approaching 1000 yards. I wouldn’t come close to him in fantasy. I still think he would be a really valuable addition, but I would understand if he chose a higher volume situation.

Maybe they will remain somewhat conservative. But, if that is the plan then they really need to go get another QB because that's not really Winston's game. I think he's a guy that you have to take the bad plays with the spectacular plays and he needs volume for the spectacular plays to happen. I also don't know why you keep PC as offensive coordinator if you plan to move to a more conservative running based offense.

As far as volume for each player, this offense works best when the ball can be spread around. So, it's better when you have on 1,000 yard WR and two 700 yard WRs. Rather than two 1,200 yard WRs. If that's an issue for Landry, then I don't think he really fits on this team. That being said, the Slot WR spot has always been a pretty high volume role for this team and if they got Landry it would probably just mean less touches in the passing game for Kamara more than anything else since he tends to work similar areas of the field. And, limiting his touches is probably a good thing for Kamara's long term future and getting some of the predictability out of this offense.

 

[St. Widge]

I think it works fine....in 2020 during our 9 game winning streak we actually ran the ball more than we threw it.....I think it comes down to our offensive line being a better run blocking line and it's more a case of playing to our strengths but I also know this is not a popular sentiment among Saints fans....and it really doesn't matter who is playing QB, be it Brees, Taysom, Teddy.....we have been run first or at least run often for a few years now....

I think that's only because Brees didn't have the arm and was getting old and injured. And with Hill at QB, that is probably the best strategy. He's a game manager and runner, not a big strike guy like Winston. In addition, 2020 was also a year without Michael Thomas and the only other WR we really had was Sanders. That's going to change how you call a game. So, I think the reliance on the run had more to do with who was at QB injured Brees/Hill and no Michael Thomas. I mean, Brees was playing with like 7 broken ribs. You really want to limit his number of drop backs in that situation. No Michael Thomas, few WR options, and injured QBs is the common denominator in years where we have been more conservative. So, I think the conservative approach was more out of necessity than being some new offensive philosophy. Hell, last year we had no WRs, a broken offensive line, and were starting 3rd and 4th string QBs. Any team is going to try to run the ball more in that situation.

 

[WhoDatNationQC]

The biggest question in my mind is whether the Saints need to pass. There will be games I’m sure they will but I’d be surprised if we aren’t in the bottom third of pass attempts…and you have Thomas and Kamara that are destined to probably get half of that production, if not more. You still have Callaway and Harris, who I still believe will have their roles (though more limited) and likely a rookie WR contributor. Even if volume goes up…I’m doubtful that you’ll see Landry come close to approaching 1000 yards. I wouldn’t come close to him in fantasy. I still think he would be a really valuable addition, but I would understand if he chose a higher volume situation.

I don't think we need to pass as much but adding a healthy MT and getting another solid options at WR2 will open up everything. Defences won't be able to stack the box as much, they won't be able to double Thomas as much and if we can land someone who can stretch the field at the draft, it will completely change our entire offense. For all the knocks Winston is getting, one thing he can do and Drew couldn't do at the later stage of his career, is throw the ball down the field.

Having 2 great route runners + a deep threat would also be Kamara's dream scenario because it would leave him 1Vs1 against linebackers more often then not and that's music to his ears because there's not a lot of MLB's that can hang with Kamara, if any.

 

[sfidc3]

I think that's only because Brees didn't have the arm and was getting old and injured. And with Hill at QB, that is probably the best strategy. He's a game manager and runner, not a big strike guy like Winston. In addition, 2020 was also a year without Michael Thomas and the only other WR we really had was Sanders. That's going to change how you call a game. So, I think the reliance on the run had more to do with who was at QB injured Brees/Hill and no Michael Thomas. I mean, Brees was playing with like 7 broken ribs. You really want to limit his number of drop backs in that situation. No Michael Thomas, few WR options, and injured QBs is the common denominator in years where we have been more conservative. So, I think the conservative approach was more out of necessity than being some new offensive philosophy. Hell, last year we had no WRs, a broken offensive line, and were starting 3rd and 4th string QBs. Any team is going to try to run the ball more in that situation.

I disagree.....we ran the ball a ton in 2018 (almost 50/50), then a bit less in 2019 (about 58/42).....we have been a run heavy team for a while now....no matter the QB....

 

[BoNcHiE]

Landry is not what he used to be. But as a possession guy, we could do a lot worse.

Just temper your expecttions. He's not going to catch 100 balls like he used to.

 

[B-Train]

Just hurry up and announce if he’s signing or not before this thread gets to 100 pages. I’ve noticed that the longer a thread goes on the less likely a thing is to happen.

 

[44slayer]

If they don't open the offense up it's a huge mistake IMO. Winston just isn't a game manager QB. He's a gun slinger. That can lead to some turnovers, but it also can lead to explosive plays. And DA said in his opening press conference that he wanted an offense that made explosive plays so I think we will see it opened up more.

And, if they don't want to open it up and take shots down field, then they need to go get another QB now. Trying to fit Winston into a low volume running game oriented offense just doesn't make sense. It's square peg in round hole stuff.

But, I do think the conservative approach last year had as much to do with the lack of any options at WR as much as putting the cuffs on Winston. I don't think Winston trusted any of his WRs and it showed in his hesitancy to throw over the middle or make relatively risk throws. So, I think he has to get over that, the offense needs to be opened up, and they need to add some weapons that Winston has more confidence in. Then again, any QB is going to need more weapons than we currently have.

Here we go again. Winston was 5-2 as a game manager last season - if he doesnt get hurt, we are likely in the playoffs with a game manager at QB. Youre confusing no risk it no biscuit with a coach calling plays in a very methodical way. He may have been made to be a gunslinger through expectations in college and in TB, and maybe he leans that way, but you cant call a guy who absolutely managed games to the tune of a 5-2 record incapable of managing games.

Payton ran the offense in a way that took into account there were very few options on the field. The same way he managed Brees once he lost the vertical passing game. Brees was absolutely a game manager his last 2 years. You cant really say "if they dont open up the offense" and then explain why we didnt in the same post.

I dont think anyone in history outside of Les Miles has ever said, we dont want an explosive offense. Youre acting like its a choice they made, as if they had these weapons that they just didnt want to use. They have played the game based on the skills of the personnel on the field. Last year, that just wasnt much.

 

[St. Widge]

I disagree.....we ran the ball a ton in 2018 (almost 50/50), then a bit less in 2019 (about 58/42).....we have been a run heavy team for a while now....no matter the QB....

You may be right, but I think that the reason for that had more to do with Brees being injured/older in those years and the lack of options at WR more than a change in philosophy. I also don't think that the 2019 run/pass ratio was what I'd call conservative other than the fact that they didn't take many shots downfield. I think 60/40 pass/run is about the right mix in today's NFL.

Anyway, like I said, if the plan is to go more conservative, and I don't think it is based on what DA has said, then Winston isn't really the QB to do that with.

 

[Lustmord]

signed by 4pm?