(long read) Let's talk Jameis Winston's future... while keeping it real. (2 Viewers)

[jahsoul357]

Manning, but he isn’t NFL starter material either at this time.

JW's predecessor in TB (Josh Freeman) was top 10 in Yards and TDs and lead a top 10 offense in 2012.... He was "not an NFL starting QB"

JW has more arm talent, and had a better supporting cast that Freeman... Outside of that, they are essential the same player, and are on a similar career trajectory.

Good list of some others here:

NFL: Ranking Quarterbacks who were one-hit wonders

The NFL is full of players who dominate on a short-term basis, but it's rare that a player is a star exactly once in their career.

nflspinzone.com

I thought Glennon (chuckling at him with the Giants) and McCown were there before Jameis. *shrugs*
Anyway, I just checked and that 2012 Bucs had Vincent Jackson before the falloff, Mike Williams before the injury, and Doug Martin, who rushed for 1400+ yards and 11 TDs, so your view on "a better supporting cast" kinda fails, especially factoring in the run attack . And they finished 9th in yard and 13th in points with Freeman finishing 9th in yards and 7th in TDs, which still doesn't line up with what I said. You don't finish (as a QB) #1 in yards, #2 in TDs and lead the #3 team in both points and yards and not be a starting QB. I'm just saying.

 

[Infoman]

I thought Glennon (chuckling at him with the Giants) and McCown were there before Jameis. *shrugs*
Anyway, I just checked and that 2012 Bucs had Vincent Jackson before the falloff, Mike Williams before the injury, and Doug Martin, who rushed for 1400+ yards and 11 TDs, so your view on "a better supporting cast" kinda fails, especially factoring in the run attack . And they finished 9th in yard and 13th in points with Freeman finishing 9th in yards and 7th in TDs, which still doesn't line up with what I said. You don't finish (as a QB) #1 in yards, #2 in TDs and lead the #3 team in both points and yards and not be a starting QB. I'm just saying.

You missed the entire point... But you always do. Freeman had top 10 numbers in 2012 in all the categories I posted, and you threw points in there.... That was not the point of me posting them though...

The point was - Outlier (anomaly) statistically good seasons without context... are just that. They don't account for Consistency, Turning those number into wins, or making the team better with sound decision making.... Which leads to getting cut, no matter where you are picked in the draft or how hard you can throw. And in no way did Freeman have a better cast than JW did his last season in Tampa. Not even kinda.

Again... Sometimes a player just is who he is, and is never going to be what you want him to be... TB realized that... The Saints eventfully did too. As evidenced by them desperately trying to replace him with Watson for a boat load of picks and $200M+... then again the very next year with Carr and $150M. Money talks... Stats walk.

 

[jahsoul357]

You missed the entire point... But you always do. Freeman had top 10 numbers in 2012 in all the categories I posted, and you threw points in there.... That was not the point of me posting them though...

Reading is fundamental, my friend


Points was always there..lol. What's the point of talking about most yards in a season when points win games?

The point was - Outlier (anomaly) statistically good seasons without context... are just that. They don't account for Consistency, Turning those number into wins, or making the team better with sound decision making.... Which leads to getting cut, no matter where you are picked in the draft or how hard you can throw.

The crazy thing is we almost gave up the barn for someone who had an outlier season and the verdict is still out on Carr depending on what you prefer.

And in no way did Freeman have a better cast than JW did his last season in Tampa. Not even kinda.

Please tell me the differences.

Again... Sometimes a player just is who he is, and is never going to be what you want him to be... TB realized that... The Saints eventfully did too. As evidenced by them desperately trying to replace him with Watson for a boat load of picks and $200M+... then again the very next year with Carr and $150M. Money talks... Stats walk.

Imagine saying this while just a few sentences ago talking about winning..lol. We were ready to give up everything for Watson and what he did during a 4-12 season and spent 150m on a QB with a losing record who got benched because he threw 4TDs and 6INTs his last 3 games of the season. That being said, this is where perception is key. You say that "TB realized that" but quoting Bruce Arians:

Since the media never spoonfed anyone any information regarding that season (and I had to go back and look myself), those last 2 games that he is speaking about was against the Texans and Falcons, where both Evans and Godwin was out for the season and he had to go out there with Breshard Perriman as WR1 and a bunch of "others" that you wouldn't be able to name. But the truth is, the only reason Jameis isn't on the Bucs is because Tom Brady fell into their laps. And honestly, if you actually know football, that was a great thing for us. They chose short term gain over long term. Bruce Arians and Carson Palmer both stated that the system is very complex based on the control that the QB actual has, the options built into the routes (and where they occur) and it being a vertical offense.


(everyone talks about what a QB can't do but how many QBs you've seen run a play like this from a 7 step drop. Matter of fact, how many times have you seen any "top" QB play under center and not run play action..lol)

Palmer said the first year is hard but the 2nd season everything clicked. If Jameis threw 5k yards, 33TDs and 30 INTs in the first season of learning a brand new offense that is considered one of the hardest to learn, what in the world do yall think would have happened year 2. Fortunately for us, the Bucs cared more about the short term. Brady pushed Arians upstairs and got BLeft fired and now they are stuck with a defensive minded head coach. lol

 

[Infoman]

You are going to need a good therapist (or exorcist) when he's out of the league in a couple seasons.... That's a LOT of non-sense for a simple response about a player that can't stay on the field and has been replaced everywhere he's been because of losing. I'm gonna drink one in your honor tonight. Be well sir... I don't have time for a 2 hour response about a Backup QB... LMAO

 

[jahsoul357]

You are going to need a good therapist (or exorcist) when he's out of the league in a couple seasons.... That's a LOT of non-sense for a simple response about a player that can't stay on the field and has been replaced everywhere he's been because of losing. I'm gonna drink one in your honor tonight. Be well sir... I don't have time for a 2 hour response about a Backup QB... LMAO

Not really, because I loved football long before him, and I'll love it long after him. I was a Saints fan before I knew who Jameis Winston was and I'll be a Saints fan long after. But I do like to show that a lot of times, people are just talking out of their butts and with certain topics, can't talk football. The fact this is your response is good enough for me..lol

Be easy!

Also, it just hit me. Dude, I probably have like 4 more sentences than you do. I just broke up your post because it was easier to respond that way. Talking about that's a lot...lol. And it's only nonsense because you have nothing to comeback with..lol

 

[BayouSAINTJoe]

Not really, because I loved football long before him, and I'll love it long after him. I was a Saints fan before I knew who Jameis Winston was and I'll be a Saints fan long after. But I do like to show that a lot of times, people are just talking out of their butts and with certain topics, can't talk football. The fact this is your response is good enough for me..lol

Be easy!

Also, it just hit me. Dude, I probably have like 4 more sentences than you do. I just broke up your post because it was easier to respond that way. Talking about that's a lot...lol. And it's only nonsense because you have nothing to comeback with..lol

He's just big mad that JW beat out TH...and won't let it go

 

[Infoman]

...and won't let it go

 

[dtc]

You missed the entire point... But you always do. Freeman had top 10 numbers in 2012 in all the categories I posted, and you threw points in there.... That was not the point of me posting them though...

The point was - Outlier (anomaly) statistically good seasons without context... are just that. They don't account for Consistency, Turning those number into wins, or making the team better with sound decision making.... Which leads to getting cut, no matter where you are picked in the draft or how hard you can throw. And in no way did Freeman have a better cast than JW did his last season in Tampa. Not even kinda.

Again... Sometimes a player just is who he is, and is never going to be what you want him to be... TB realized that... The Saints eventfully did too. As evidenced by them desperately trying to replace him with Watson for a boat load of picks and $200M+... then again the very next year with Carr and $150M. Money talks... Stats walk.

Winston has always been a high producer. The outllier for him is the 30 int season with that idiot biscuit risker.

 

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There's a wide spectrum of opinions on WHY Jameis is not the starter, even after Carr is on the roster.

The bolded portion is literally 100% the reason Jameis is not the starter.

Carr was/is viewed as an upgrade. That doesn't mean Jameis isn't talented and hasn't had some unfortunate luck the last few years.

 

[DSnfla]

Not really, because I loved football long before him, and I'll love it long after him. I was a Saints fan before I knew who Jameis Winston was and I'll be a Saints fan long after. But I do like to show that a lot of times, people are just talking out of their butts and with certain topics, can't talk football. The fact this is your response is good enough for me..lol

Be easy!

Also, it just hit me. Dude, I probably have like 4 more sentences than you do. I just broke up your post because it was easier to respond that way. Talking about that's a lot...lol. And it's only nonsense because you have nothing to comeback with..lol

Jah, so if you've been a Saints fan long before JW got here how come you just joined in 2020? THE very same yr JW became a Saint

 

[BayouSAINTJoe]

Jah, so if you've been a Saints fan long before JW got here how come you just joined in 2020? THE very same yr JW became a Saint

This place as wonderful as it is isn't a gatekeeper to Saintfandom

 

[jahsoul357]

Jah, so if you've been a Saints fan long before JW got here how come you just joined in 2020? THE very same yr JW became a Saint

So saintsreport is my ticket to fandom?

 

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Jah, so if you've been a Saints fan long before JW got here how come you just joined in 2020? THE very same yr JW became a Saint

So by "join date" logic, I didn't become a Saints fan until December 2009.

Wish somebody had told me that during the Ditka and Haslett/Brooks years.

 

[BreesusSaves]

Ah yes, bringing up join dates. The fastest way to let everyone know you lost the argument on a forum.

 

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Ah yes, bringing up join dates. The fastest way to let everyone know you lost the argument on a forum.

Silence, frontrunner, you got your fandom start in 2009 just like I did