Haener starts vs Commanders: 1 INT, 5 punts ; Rattler replaced Haener in 2H: led to 19 points (2 Viewers)

[DaveXA]

I really struggle with the idea that they were quality starters. Even Smith got so incredibly frustrated with Delhomme as a QB, and Brooks had teammates trying to fight him. If I remember right, someone actually punched him on the airplane on the way back (was it Charles Bentley or Charles Grant or someone else?)

Idk. Neither meets my standard of quality starters, and more so of “really good backup”.

I mean, you can choose to ignore their stats, but whatever floats your boat I suppose.

 

[greatshow25]

Moving the goal post is also when you say “Haener came in garbage time to score a TD” and not admitting that Rattler couldn’t even do that. Haener also didn’t just score a TD, he drove the field with authority and complete command of the offense. Something else Rattler lacked.

Ok it’s been a while since the Denver game so I had to go back and look it up again. Everyone talks about Haener on the drive, but the drive was started by Rattler and Miller running the ball. Rattler picked up a 4 and 1 and scrambled for a 5 yard game. They had the ball at the 48 yard line and Mike Hoss said Rattler got banged up on the play at the 2 minute warning. Then on 3 and 5 there was PI and they finished the drive for a touchdown so Haener completed 3 passes. Rattler started the game on his first 2 or 3 drives like 4/6 with a drop and a no call PI. Only thing I’m saying is that people are making it seem worse than what it was. Every start he had there was at least 3 to 4 drops a ton of costly penalties at the wrong time. I think Haener can run the offense but I think Rattler has more talent. All I said was give him a chance with a better OL. Instead of playing with 3 and 4 string line.

 

[AARPSaint]

There are so many strange circumstances involved with evaluating these QBs. Both are young and played with injured players of various sorts. For now, I think Haener is the more polished QB,

As for the future the Saints could get to the playoffs next year with Carr IMHO, but I don’t believe there’s a lot of future there—and I doubt that the future QB is in the upcoming draft. We’re kind of stuck with what we have, so let’s fortify the positions that are strong in the 2025 draft.

 

[Mojomajik9]

I don’t think Jake starting is an indictment of Rattler. In fact, if I had to bet, I would bet Rattler will start at least one more game this season.

But as this sorry season winds down it’s good to get Jake out there and see what he can do. You never know what’ll happen until the bullets start flying. At least it makes a game I assume we will lose a bit more interesting.

 

[DSnfla]

You keep repeating this and for the 3rd or 4th time, it is not really accurate. Rattler had Olave for like one possession, only had Hill in the Chargers game which was his first game back from injury, and only had Shaheed for most of one game. And he was mostly playing with 2nd and 3rd string interior OL that were mostly playing hurt and he didn't have MVS who is likely our 2nd best WR even if Shaheed was healthy. And you know that McCoy is a huge part of the OL and have repeatedly used it as an excuse for why KK's offense wasn't working, but for some reason you choose to ignore that when talking about Rattler vs. Haener.

Haener is almost no doubt more ready to start than Rattler. And he should be since he has had one more training camp, one more year in the league, and one offseason working with Gruden. So, if he wasn't further along that would be very surprising. I think he will play a bit better than Rattler, but we really won't fully know what we have in Rattler until next year when he has an offseason and another camp to get ready. And maybe not even then.

But, I'm fine giving Haener these starts because then we will have a pretty good idea what we have in Haener. I think his upside is good backup, but I hope I'm wrong and he ends up being a really good starter.

The fact of the matter is that SR had starters as weapons in various parts and sometimes all of the games he started something JH will not. I disagree that MVS would be better or get more snaps than Shaheed but that's debatable. Yes McCoy makes a difference but he was the only starter on the OL missing in the Charger game and Olave and Taysom played that game and it was Rattler's worst game

It is for those reasons you mentioned that I thought at the time and still do think it was a mistake to start SR over JH in that 3 game stretch. He has a better command of the offense and makes better decisions and makes them quicker

 

[DSnfla]

Rattler is more accurate that Haener. But, at this point Haener is likely more ready to start.

What makes you say SR is more accurate?

 

[DSnfla]

Ok it’s been a while since the Denver game so I had to go back and look it up again. Everyone talks about Haener on the drive, but the drive was started by Rattler and Miller running the ball. Rattler picked up a 4 and 1 and scrambled for a 5 yard game. They had the ball at the 48 yard line and Mike Hoss said Rattler got banged up on the play at the 2 minute warning. Then on 3 and 5 there was PI and they finished the drive for a touchdown so Haener completed 3 passes. Rattler started the game on his first 2 or 3 drives like 4/6 with a drop and a no call PI. Only thing I’m saying is that people are making it seem worse than what it was. Every start he had there was at least 3 to 4 drops a ton of costly penalties at the wrong time. I think Haener can run the offense but I think Rattler has more talent. All I said was give him a chance with a better OL. Instead of playing with 3 and 4 string line.

LOL you sure can twist things. SR was ineffectual the whole game and had a fumble caught in the air for a defensive TD. That last drive was ALL Miller
Of the 5 passes Haener threw 2 were dropped 1 was caught for a gain by Tipton. A 10yd pass Wilson and the other was a TD to Wilson. JH came in and did what SR could not all game make quick decisions and crisp throws and change the play when he was a blitz coming

 

[St. Widge]

What makes you say SR is more accurate?

What I see when they throw the ball. Haener is find with short passes, but he has accuracy issue on intermediate and deep throws. Rattler is more accurate in both areas. Rattler's issue at this point is that he can't throw in rhythm and doesn't read defenses quick enough. Haener is certainly further along in that regard and he does likely give the team a better chance to win, but I still don't think he's likely to be the better QB long term. But, I could be wrong.

In the end, I just hope that one of them can become a very good starting QB because it would quickly change the trajectory of the team if one of them is.

 

[saintsmarchin]

Zoolander versus this commander in 2 hours.

 

[sfidc3]

Wait, I want to point something out here because I'm not the only poster to see the incredible hypocrisy this guy above displays on a regular basis.....

So, to help make his point in this thread he downplays the fact that McCoy is out because he was the only starter missing.....

Yes McCoy makes a difference but he was the only starter on the OL missing in the Charger game and Olave and Taysom played that game and it was Rattler's worst game

Back when we lose to the Eagles, a typical DA led Saints loss, McCoy is superman and once he went out we had no chance against the Eagles....and would have certainly beat them had he remained in the game.....

Your post is just ridiculous, McCoy IS the superman of our OL, He makes the protection calls and it would have been him blocking Carter. So people saying him going out is a BS excuse it just moronic. Had he been in there we would have run the ball better and blocked Carter better which equals better offense and more scoring. Philly's depth at OL is probably better than ours also they did not lose their CENTER. Believe me Philly's DT's are miles better than anyone ATL has on the DL

So which is it? Does McCoy only matter under certain circumstances? I'm confused....(I'm not, this guy spouts BS all over the place).....

And to the original OP, at this point I think it makes sense to take a look at Haener, given the notion that it appears (at least to the coaches) that neither separated themselves in practice during the week.....

 

[DaveXA]

Wait, I want to point something out here because I'm not the only poster to see the incredible hypocrisy this guy above displays on a regular basis.....

So, to help make his point in this thread he downplays the fact that McCoy is out because he was the only starter missing.....



Back when we lose to the Eagles, a typical DA led Saints loss, McCoy is superman and once he went out we had no chance against the Eagles....and would have certainly beat them had he remained in the game.....



So which is it? Does McCoy only matter under certain circumstances? I'm confused....(I'm not, this guy spouts BS all over the place).....

And to the original OP, at this point I think it makes sense to take a look at Haener, given the notion that it appears (at least to the coaches) that neither separated themselves in practice during the week.....

Yeah, it's clear that McCoy is probably the most consequential loss, especially for a rookie QB because of the experience and the protections he calls. Not having Hill is probably about as impactful with his play making abilities. Neither Rattler or Haener are going to be playing in ideal conditions. Part of their evaluation does include how they handle adversity, and I think this is a good chance for the coaches, and the front office to get some game film for Haener then they can make some decisions this offseason.

 

[Hedon James]

Wait, I want to point something out here because I'm not the only poster to see the incredible hypocrisy this guy above displays on a regular basis.....

So, to help make his point in this thread he downplays the fact that McCoy is out because he was the only starter missing.....



Back when we lose to the Eagles, a typical DA led Saints loss, McCoy is superman and once he went out we had no chance against the Eagles....and would have certainly beat them had he remained in the game.....



So which is it? Does McCoy only matter under certain circumstances? I'm confused....(I'm not, this guy spouts BS all over the place).....

And to the original OP, at this point I think it makes sense to take a look at Haener, given the notion that it appears (at least to the coaches) that neither separated themselves in practice during the week.....

But you forgot to mention that his quoted posts didn't say "In my opinion..." or "I believe....", so obviously he was in FACT, stating FACTS! What are we to think when his "facts" conflict with each other? And you gotta love that other peoples' opinions are "ridiculous" and "moronic" when they're not aligned with his...

It's a shame, because he sometimes brings an interesting perspective to the topic, but moving the goalposts like he does, and contradicting himself like he does, keeps me from affording him any real consideration. I won't be engaging him anymore, because it's been pointed out several times, but he continues to do it. So either he doesn't care, is incapable of seeing it even when it's pointed out, lacks critical perspective, or is simply pathological. Doesn't matter to me which one it is...I have neither the time nor patience to deal with it. If I can't have an intelligent and civilized discourse with someone without them defaulting to "ridiculous" and "moronic" arguments when different perspectives are presented, I no longer care what that "other" perspective may be. I'll read what he wrote, then scroll on by. I've lost interest in his opinions. He's no longer credible to me...

 

[DavidM]

I liked Haener in the draft. I think he has an underrated skill set, though I think Widge is right that he needs to show improvement in accuracy. I’m looking forward to seeing how he performs today.

 

[Hedon James]

I agreed with coaching earlier in the year, to start Rattler over Haener; because the offensive line was in tatters, with 3rd and 4th string options starting in the MIDDLE. I don't believe Rattler was "ready" for the start, but he has a TON of experience scrambling behind a substandard line. And for me, that tipped the scale to Rattler.

I agree with coaching NOW, giving the start to Haener. I don't know for certain, but i suspect Haener is further in his development as QB, with 2 training camps, an entire season of experience, and offseason tutelage with Gruden. Haener is also more similar to Carr playing style than Rattler. I'm not saying that's a good thing, or a bad thing, because different styles each have their own merit. But the fact is...this offense and the playcalling has been geared toward Carr's skillset. And with OL issues not providing Ratter's scrambling/mobility an edge, the edge now goes to Haener due to similarity to Carr's skillset.

Added bonus....we'll now have additional game type of REAL game situations on Haener. Doesn't matter if the next HC is Rizzi, or someone else. We need to know what we have with the young guns behind Carr, because Carr may not be here in 2025; and almost certainly won't be here in 2026. Do we need to keep burning draft picks on QBs until we hit on one? Or do we already have "the guy", who just needs some more seasoning and time in the oven? I'm more interested in that, than the final score of this game, to be honest.

 

[Rouxble]

I liked Haener in the draft. I think he has an underrated skill set, though I think Widge is right that he needs to show improvement in accuracy. I’m looking forward to seeing how he performs today.

I bashed Haener’s arm strength after we drafted him, still psyched to see him start. Season is done, let’s see what he and some of the other young players can do.