Israel (now broader Mid East discussion) (13 Viewers)

[Mr. Sparkle]

I should have added a caveat that "if they were not citizens." Students may or may not be citizens. To be clear, students can be and are sometimes deported when they break laws here. That's part of being a guest in the country.

FWIW foreigners can be arrested too. We have plenty of non-citizens in US prisons, especially down in this part of the world near the border states.

Not that I am in favor of arresting anyone who is engaged in peaceful protest (no matter how vile), just saying.

 

[DaveXA]

FWIW foreigners can be arrested too. We have plenty of non-citizens in US prisons, especially down in this part of the world near the border states.

Not that I am in favor of arresting anyone who is engaged in peaceful protest (no matter how vile), just saying.

Agreed. And of course no one peacefully protesting should be arrested. That goes without saying, but yeah.

 

[jboss]

I should have added a caveat that "if they were not citizens." Students may or may not be citizens. To be clear, students can be and are sometimes deported when they break laws here. That's part of being a guest in the country.

Citizenship aside, still pretty strange to suggest they should be deported for that. And as far as the law is concerned, no laws were broken. There were no arrests made, no charges filed.

 

[DaveXA]

Citizenship aside, still pretty strange to suggest they should be deported for that. And as far as the law is concerned, no laws were broken. There were no arrests made, no charges filed.

Correct, which is why I stated that I was relieved no one got hurt. No one needed to get deported based on what happened.

That said, had it gone differently? Who knows?

 

[livefromDC]

I'm gonna say it again, you're ascribing something about what I said that is not there. You're taking what I said and turning it into something that I didn't say or imply. First, you implied I said something about religion, which I didn't, then you're now implying I said something about facial features, stereotypes and presumptions about where they're from when I did nothing of the sort.

And fwiw, my wife is Asian American.

I know. That's why I thought it would make the point more clearly.

Dave, I didn't say that you said something about religion, facial features, etc. I'm saying the implication of saying these students should be deported if they're not US citizens implies more than what you think it did even if you don't realize it or didn't mean to.

I purposely used Asian Americans because people have made the same implication you did and cover it the same way you did.

Person 1: Why can't they just go back to where they came from?
Person 2: They're from here.
Person 1: Well, if they aren't from here...they should go back to China or wherever.
Person 2: They were born here.
Person 1: I'm just saying, if they're not born here, they should go back to where they came from. Relax, it's no big deal.

At any rate, I think I've made my point. And you've made your point. So I'll leave it alone. I just think this whole situation is too emotionally charged already without us introducing rhetoric that makes assumptions about people who have taken either side.

 

[SamAndreas]

To the contrary. Xenophobic rhetoric never starts with large sweeping gestures. This is how it starts, as a seemingly harmless statement about facial features, stereotypes and presumptions about where they are from and to whom are they loyal.

The undertones of Dave's statement are there. Choosing to ignore them or basically say, "well I"m probably right" because of anecdotal experience doesn't lessen that. But since Dave brought it up, as an adjunct professor, I'm still on a college campus. I will be again today. And these kids are very much siding with Palestine and they are very much born and raised on US soil. Your presumption is not as harmless you think. People have used "they're not even from here" or "go back to your own country" to make Asian Americans who are born and raised here feel set a part or "othered". I would think you'd be more sensitive to the harm these type of opinions could have. Is that somehow different? Making a sweeping generalization about college kids on a college campus is different than making a sweeping generalization about Asian Americans who making a living and raised their families in the suburbs? Words do indeed have meaning.

Well, you certainly affirmed my point by making another mountain out of another mole hill.

 

[livefromDC]

Well, you certainly affirmed my point by making another mountain out of another mole hill.

You are the guy in my example.

 

[0rion]

I think in this thread or another thread I said "both sides can be wrong". Pretty sure that's what we have here. I don't agree with what either side is doing. I don't have a dog in the fight as far as point of view .....just think there's always room for many points of view with out killing over them. I've seen pics and video from both sides that makes me wonder what kinda person can do that to another person. It's just sad and disappointing.

 

[Mr. Sparkle]

Interesting fact - the largest group of foreigners/non-Israelis being held hostage by Hamas are Thai farm workers. 54 out of the 224 people being held are Thai.

The Thais caught up in the Israel-Gaza war

Thousands of Thais who work in farms across Israel have found themselves caught in the crossfire.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[DaveXA]

Interesting fact - the largest group of foreigners/non-Israelis being held hostage by Hamas are Thai farm workers. 54 out of the 224 people being held are Thai.

The Thais caught up in the Israel-Gaza war

Thousands of Thais who work in farms across Israel have found themselves caught in the crossfire.

www.bbc.co.uk

Never would have guessed that. I saw a story on a Thai who was kidnapped, but didn't realize there were that many of them.

 

[baarbogast]

 

[baarbogast]

 

[baarbogast]

 

[Infoman]

Anyone still think Iran wasn't directly involved in the funding, planning, and execution of the initial terror attack that kicked off this shirt show?

Anyone still think that they (Iran) are not desperately trying to pull the US into direct conflict?

Anyone want to guess how long political speak and half measures are gonna hold up once we have a bunch of dead US soldiers that get hit by Iranian "proxy" ordinance?

Can both sides be wrong? Yep... Can both sides win.... Nope. I know who Russia, China, N Korea, and Iran wants to come out on top here... so it makes my decision pretty easy on who to support. Get ya minds right "Americans".

 

[DaveXA]

Anyone still think Iran wasn't directly involved in the funding, planning, and execution of the initial terror attack that kicked off this shirt show?

Anyone still think that they (Iran) are not desperately trying to pull the US into direct conflict?

Anyone want to guess how long political speak and half measures are gonna hold up once we have a bunch of dead US soldiers that get hit by Iranian "proxy" ordinance?

Can both sides be wrong? Yep... Can both sides win.... Nope. I know who Russia, China, N Korea, and Iran wants to come out on top here... so it makes my decision pretty easy on who to support. Get ya minds right "Americans".

Hamas is reportedly in Russia today for...reasons.