clearing the deck - the marriage status thread (9 Viewers)

[CapitalCitySaint]

you can decide not to date anyone for any reason at all, superficial or otherwise.

This is a very valid point and applies to everyone. People are human and evolve and grow and can decide at any moment they want something different for their lives. Obviously if you're married, it's not as simple but it's still doable.

 

[Booker]

What's the definition of "can't"? Like if it's, You will absolutely never ever fart in front of me or it's over? I would agree it's unreasonable and untenable.

If "can't" is more like, Can you, please, try not to fart in front of me so often because at this point it seems like you're doing it on purpose?, that's just inconsiderate to not find another room to fart in.

"Can't" as in the first one. I'm not saying you need to get all Terrence and Phillip on each other, and there are definitely times you would want leave the room out of consideration. But there comes a point in a relationship when you and your partner should be comfortable enough to let one go in each other's presence without feeling shame. It's actually, I think, very intimate to reach that state of comfort around each other.

 

[Tapxe]

I asked questions. I got in-depth answers beyond what I asked for which gave me insight as to where he is emotionally and mentally. This happened in November. I reiterate that when I met him, he was only separated for 4 months. 3 of those 4 months he was under the impression that he was going back home at the end of 3 months & very much wanted to save his marriage. When I met him, he was only a month removed from being told the trial separation was permanent. He is 48 years old and had been with his wife since he was 20 (with some openness in the relationship when he was in the NFL & Euro league). Married for 20 years. You don't get over that in 1 month - particularly if you were the one "blindsided" by the separation and not wanting the divorce.

They have a $1.2 million dollar house that they do not intend to sell until June-ish when this school year was over due to the kids. Speaking of kids, he works remotely. For some reason, the wife's mom is living with his wife helping her with school pickups and taking the kids to sports. Why isn't he doing that? Why is he living in a short-term rental centrally when they live up in the suburbs and if he was truly "over it" and there was "no going back" why doesn't he have a permanent place up near his kids to help with things with the kids because supposedly they both have agreed to keeping the kids in the same school because they are in high school?

At the end of the day, I don't need to ask questions. He's still married and that's enough for me to say no. I am not required to give anyone still married the benefit of the doubt. I am completely free and able to date and fully commit myself to someone. I am under no obligation to do the same for someone else who cannot.

And if he was already divorced and had his life sorted out & able to really be in a relationship, all this baggage would have never had to be a topic of discussion FOR A SECOND DATE and we would have instead been discussing our likes and dislikes and seeing if we were compatible as opposed to negotiating a potential situation in which he was still married. JFC I cannot believe I even have to explain this.

I see the problem now. I didn't comprehend. I'll work on that.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

Deciding not date someone is not the same thing as belittling, denigrating, degrading, etc someone. Especially after only 2 dates. That is very much in the getting to know you phase... and at the point, you can decide not to date anyone for any reason at all, superficial or otherwise.

while undoubtedly true, it does remind me of what I wrote about being in grad school and having an open LDR
I felt that as long as I was honest with potential paramours then I was being responsible
but my actions had consequences that spread wider than the little safety net i'd built for myself

sure you can break up with anyone for any reason and don't really need to provide any explanation, but some consideration should be paid to potential effect
doesn't mean you should change your actions, but acknowledge your actions effect more than just yourself

TBC, I'm not saying CCS did this in the slightest - her text to the guy carried more communication about wants than my wife has been able to provide in the last few years (and I admittedly swallowed a lot just to avoid potential fights)

 

[saintmdterps]

while undoubtedly true, it does remind me of what I wrote about being in grad school and having an open LDR
I felt that as long as I was honest with potential paramours then I was being responsible
but my actions had consequences that spread wider than the little safety net i'd built for myself

sure you can break up with anyone for any reason and don't really need to provide any explanation, but some consideration should be paid to potential effect
doesn't mean you should change your actions, but acknowledge your actions effect more than just yourself

TBC, I'm not saying CCS did this in the slightest - her text to the guy carried more communication about wants than my wife has been able to provide in the last few years (and I admittedly swallowed a lot just to avoid potential fights)

The rules of engagement were considerably different when we were in our 20's. Our lives for the most part weren't full of divorce, drama, peace bonds, and exes from long-term relationships. I was honest as I needed to be with the women I dated. That can be interpreted as "if you want the answer then ask the question, but don't ask the question unless you're ready for the answer" That said, I treated the women I dated with dignity and respect, even if there were multiple paramours.

This is how, when you're dating three women, two show up at the same men's slow-pitch softball game, each completely unaware of the existence of the other. Needless to say, those two relationships ended in a mushroom cloud and a crater to the eternal delight of my teammates who had gleefully maintained I would eventually self-immolate.

I did learn from my mistake. The third woman never got within a mile of my stupid softball games nor anywhere near my idiot teammates.

 

[Madmarsha]

while undoubtedly true, it does remind me of what I wrote about being in grad school and having an open LDR
I felt that as long as I was honest with potential paramours then I was being responsible
but my actions had consequences that spread wider than the little safety net i'd built for myself

When very, very young, I got in the middle of one of those "well, yes, I have a girlfriend back home but we've agreed I can date but I have to tell her". So he met me, told her, and then suddenly the high school girlfriend back home wasn't so cool about her boyfriend dating anymore. I wish I could say I nope'd on outta there cleanly but it was a good education on relationships.

Spoiler alert: He never ended up with her either, apparently, so I guess it was a good education on relationships for him, too.

 

[Madmarsha]

I did learn from my mistake. The third woman never got within a mile of my stupid softball games nor anywhere near my idiot teammates.

OMG, that reminds me. The boyfriend fresh off his divorce from his high school girlfriend that messed him up, one of the things he would ghost me for was his softball. He played as often as he could now that he was single. I mean, it was nice for him that he was now free to play that much but he was obsessed.

You guys sure had a bunch of high school girlfriends that really messed it up for some of us.

 

[saintmdterps]

When very, very young, I got in the middle of one of those "well, yes, I have a girlfriend back home but we've agreed I can date but I have to tell her". So he met me, told her, and then suddenly the high school girlfriend back home wasn't so cool about her boyfriend dating anymore. I wish I could say I nope'd on outta there cleanly but it was a good education on relationships.

Spoiler alert: He never ended up with her either, apparently, so I guess it was a good education on relationships for him, too.

Yup had several LDR's in college and in the years thereafter. Two or three held the provision that it was okay to date others, but not to sleep with anyone else. We just had to keep each other informed. Yes, it got messy once or twice, but I always honored the "no sleeping with.." rule. I was as sure as I could be that they did too.

Edit: I thought nothing of getting in my car after a long week and driving 2+ hours to spend the weekend with those girlfriends, and they repaid the favor. Sleep was an afterthought and those were some blissful weekends. These days I can't handle the idea of driving 30 miles for a date if it's going to start after 7pm, lol.

 

[saintmdterps]

OMG, that reminds me. The boyfriend fresh off his divorce from his high school girlfriend that messed him up, one of the things he would ghost me for was his softball. He played as often as he could now that he was single. I mean, it was nice for him that he was now free to play that much but he was obsessed.

You guys sure had a bunch of high school girlfriends that really messed it up for some of us.

Once I graduated high school I never dated another high school girl, and there were no ties. To me going away to college meant getting rid of high school ways and learning new things. To say the vistas opened up is putting it mildly.

My college years up to my early 30's were the best days of my life. I was then and am now grateful for the vast bulk of those experiences, most of which were conducted through the lenses of unbounded optimism. I'd lop off an arm to get that optimism back, I really miss it.

 

[Madmarsha]

Once I graduated high school I never dated another high school girl, and there were no ties. To me going away to college meant getting rid of high school ways and learning new things. To say the vistas opened up is putting it mildly.

Like I said, I assume the experience was an education for my little Rod (yes, his name was Rodney), too. If I ran into him, his roommate wouldn't rat him out or anything directly (that poor guy, I'd cry on his shoulder) but would drop comments that kind of let me know that little Rod was probably realizing that a LDR wasn't really a good idea.

 

[HoustonSaint68]

No matter how bad a marriage is, barring some sort of real abuse, is it ever one person's fault. One person's actions may have been more catipulting than the other but usually, there is plenty of blame to go around. Sometimes it isn't the actions you took that led to divorce but your inactions.

Truth.

When my first wife wanted a divorce, every single person in our lives thought she was nuts, because they thought I checked all the boxes.

Well, maybe I checked all of their old-school boxes but, 40 years later, I still occasionally have to tell my mom (and hers!!) that I had a notable share of blame in things falling apart.

That said, she is on husband #4 sooooo....

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

When very, very young, I got in the middle of one of those "well, yes, I have a girlfriend back home but we've agreed I can date but I have to tell her". So he met me, told her, and then suddenly the high school girlfriend back home wasn't so cool about her boyfriend dating anymore. I wish I could say I nope'd on outta there cleanly but it was a good education on relationships.

Spoiler alert: He never ended up with her either, apparently, so I guess it was a good education on relationships for him, too.

ours was ...complicated
we were together about a year when I got my touring gig
then maybe a year after that she got a teaching job in holland and that was about the time we realized that the only way to stay together was to open the relationship
then she started dancing with Martha graham and I went to grad school
we were together for about 7 years, but it was actually texas that ended the relationship - I got a university position in denton and she was like I am NOT moving to texas
more than likely the relationship had petered out and not being together actually prolonged it
weirdly one of the worst parts of the breakup was losing her brother - he's one of my favorite people ever

 

[Madmarsha]

ours was ...complicated
we were together about a year when I got my touring gig
then maybe a year after that she got a teaching job in holland and that was about the time we realized that the only way to stay together was to open the relationship
then she started dancing with Martha graham and I went to grad school
we were together for about 7 years, but it was actually texas that ended the relationship - I got a university position in denton and she was like I am NOT moving to texas
more than likely the relationship had petered out and not being together actually prolonged it
weirdly one of the worst parts of the breakup was losing her brother - he's one of my favorite people ever

Yeah, that's a lot of different stuff in a lot of different directions to try to get a relationship through even with the best of intentions.

And that's the thing. You get married and promise that "two shall be as one" ... but that's poppycock. You are still individuals. And you don't control each other. I laugh when I hear people say, "You let your wife/husband do that?" I know we all say stuff like that, but there's really no "letting" of another human being except for your children..

 

[The Nomad]

ours was ...complicated
we were together about a year when I got my touring gig
then maybe a year after that she got a teaching job in holland and that was about the time we realized that the only way to stay together was to open the relationship
then she started dancing with Martha graham and I went to grad school
we were together for about 7 years, but it was actually texas that ended the relationship - I got a university position in denton and she was like I am NOT moving to texas
more than likely the relationship had petered out and not being together actually prolonged it
weirdly one of the worst parts of the breakup was losing her brother - he's one of my favorite people ever

In her defense, texas does suck. Not that Louisiana doesn't, but it's a bigger suck in texas.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

In her defense, texas does suck. Not that Louisiana doesn't, but it's a bigger suck in texas.

oh I don't begrudge her even a tiny bit
upon leaving I said out loud that my shadow does not need to darken Texas soil ever again