Demanding, Detailed, Accountable Klint Kubiak is winning over coaches and players alike (2 Viewers)

[syeager]

My apologies. I drank a lot at the pool today. Yall enjoy

Stop drinking pool water.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

So if you have deflated players sulking in post game interviews, having no answers bc they are trying to be dismissive in regards to poor execution, you’re telling me that even a small chance couldn’t possibly uplift them? If they are happy now that there is a new OC, imagine what they would’ve felt like in that moment (or moments) when a change was needed. No one knows if a change would’ve changed our course, but even if a change didn’t work, then we would’ve still been where we finished last year, with no playoff berth.
Oh and about your tidbit of Curry. Every first time OC has never called plays at the NFL level. So what does that even mean by he has never called plays? You think all OCs just magically wake up one morning with experience at calling plays? Plus, if never had anyone behind PC who he trusted stepping into that role, if things went South, which they did, then that is an indictment on the coaching of as well. You have to have people prepared to assume the wheels of the operations.
Last but not least, maybe Dorsey was the problem. I know, it’s completely ironic how the Bills won 6 of their last 7 games AFTER Dorsey was fired. But yeah, that was all Josh Allen. He doesn’t need an offensive system, he just needs to stop stinking it up. Nothing to see there

This is so redundant.

WHO were they going to fire Pete for and hire? There’s absolutely 0 data that suggest firing Pete would have turned around the season

There is ACTUAL data that in the last 5 weeks of the season Derek Carr was ranked between 1st and 3rd in several categories. TD to INT ratio, passer ratings and the Red zone pct Under none other than the man you wanted him to fire.

Keeping him was absolutely the RIGHT choice. Get over it

No matter how you try to spin your argument it’s based on your emotion and feeling vs fact because the fact is the offense was by and large successful after the bye week.

Had it not been you’d 100% be correct in saying he should have fired him but literally nothing supports your logic other than the other people who share your flawed logic.

This argument has spanned 3 different threads and it’s tiresome and wrong

 

[jahsoul357]

I remember it differently. I remember TA holding out until after the air cleared w/ Watson to sign w/ Dolphins. He wanted to know we were getting a QB b4 making a decision.

In fact Watson was traded on March 20, Terron signed w/ Dolphins Mar 22. He was indeed waiting and it confirms what Underhill reported at the time that Armstead would have returned if we’d nabbed Watson

Actually it was Matt Miller

Saints free agent Terron Armstead waiting on Deshaun Watson situation

The NFL world is wondering why we haven't heard much about New Orleans Saints free agent tackle Terron Armstead and now we know why.

whodatdish.com

Which is crazy when you think about it. Shows that hype can even get to All-Pro/Pro Bowl players.
If Watson struggled with a 2 time coach of the year, what in the world would he do with Sneaky Pete and Co? lol

 

[SweetT]

Stop drinking pool water.

Before this you quoted with no actual quote. I may not be the only one drinking pool water

This is so redundant.

WHO were they going to fire Pete for and hire? There’s absolutely 0 data that suggest firing Pete would have turned around the season

There is ACTUAL data that in the last 5 weeks of the season Derek Carr was ranked between 1st and 3rd in several categories. TD to INT ratio, passer ratings and the Red zone pct Under none other than the man you wanted him to fire.

Keeping him was absolutely the RIGHT choice. Get over it

No matter how you try to spin your argument it’s based on your emotion and feeling vs fact because the fact is the offense was by and large successful after the bye week.

Had it not been you’d 100% be correct in saying he should have fired him but literally nothing supports your logic other than the other people who share your flawed logic.

This argument has spanned 3 different threads and it’s tiresome and wrong

Playing garbage opponents to finish the season and saying that /PC turned it around, is putting lipstick on a pig. Like I said, no one knows if an OC change would’ve made a difference, but what we DO know, is (in hindsight) we still didn’t make the playoffs, even beating the Panthers, Giants, a banged up led Baker Bucs team, and Falcons with a lame duck coach. In fact, our most exciting and interesting play (of the entire season) came on a play that was not called by PC, nor was the snap taken by DC4 (the play that netted the Falcons an apology). 28 straight weeks of inept offense, reporters constantly asking about the job status of PC, players with the life sucked out of them, coaches with zero answers to the problems, etc can all be proven bud, so no, I’m not wrong. 4 measly weeks of beating up on inferior opponents does not, in any way, overshadow what transpired over the course of 2 seasons. Plus, if what you say is correct, then why is PC not here anymore to “build” on how we finished? Did he not figure it out like you say he did? So, putting the tea leaves together (from the span of 3 threads), couldn’t fire PC bc he had no backup plan, in case he had to fire PC at any point of the season. So, yes he should shoulder the blame for many reasons regarding our OC situation and ineptitude of the offense.

Btw, we dropped our first two games after the bye week like the Falcons dropped/repelled Ludacris from the ceiling of their Mercedes Dome. The two playoff teams we played wrecked us prison style. So no, we never figured it out. You are only as good as your toughest tests and we completely failed those. Your argument would be more correct, had we won at least one of those games, but we can’t now can we?

 

[Rexman100]

I feel like the system may allow for easier development of QBs but it may expose skill position players who don’t study. The 49ers drafted several WRs in Shanahans first few years that didn’t pan out, and based on what we’ve been told it was likely because they weren’t in the playbook enough.

So skill position guys may be harder to develop or get instant impacts from. Where in Payton’s system you could get a Kenny Still, Marques Colston, Michael Thomas or Chris Olave to produce year 1. Every now and again you got a Meachem or a Nick Toon but you ended up with far more contributors like Lance Moore than not.

interesting take. This is the kind of data I’m looking for. How well did a team do the first second and third year after acquiring their shannahan/mcvay/Kubiak system coach. How big is the learning curve? What are the positions that make or break the system? And what is the position besides QB that if the talent was acquired, take it to the next level? I can state my opinion, that Taysom should be one of those next level players, but that’s just an opinion with no data to back it up.

 

[Rexman100]

It's funny how easily most people misinterpret what I say.

I didn't defend Pete the play-caller. I said dismissing his ability to design plays as though he's some wash of a coach is not intelligent. Not being a good play-caller doesn't correlate with not being a bright offensive mind. Pete was miscast as a play-caller, he's not miscast as an OC. Some people are better behind the scenes. And you absolutely meant to harp, I respect it when it's just said vs preceded with a disclaimer like "not to harp on you" Cheers

If LSU had a strength and conditioning coach for 15 years, I’d assume he’s a good strength and conditioning coach.

 

[Rexman100]

If we field a formidable top 5 offense, Kubiak is gone. He would immediately check every head coaching box.

Yea this fact has me concerned as well. However, if you were asked right now, would you trade a coordinator for a top 5 ranking the following year? Assuming our D is middle of the pack vs the run and top 5 vs the pass, then I’d expect this team to at least make it to the conference championship game. Would u trade an OC for a conference champ game the following year ? Regardless, It’s not a given that he’d leave if he had success, look at Detroit’s OC, he turned down head coaching opportunities.

 

[Rexman100]

We may need to start having an honest conversation about why we lost most of our games in 2012. It wasn't because of the defense...
-Washington: Offense
-Panthers: Offense
-Broncos: Offense
-49ers: Offense
-Falcons: Offense
-Giants: Offense

6 of our 9 losses could easily be put on our offense crapping the bed but we want to hold on to Pete doing a great job that season?


Our QB issue was tied to 3 of the 4 things below that were our real issues in 2022-2023.
-Coaching
-O-line
-Run game
-D-line

The problem is, there are a lot of people that didn't look at anything outside of the quarterback for the issues we were facing before Carr. There were post and media articles about how Pete can now open up the playbook and how O-line issues were tied to Winston and Dalton not being able to call protections or as we heard all off-season "pre-snap." QB was only a "fairly big issue" for those that wanted to make it so. Those other 4 bullet points eclipsed anything related to the QB position.

On another note, I wonder how my boy is doing in Cleveland?



From March:


Their training camp will be interesting...

JW would fit in an 8 old lady bridge game. He gets people for sure. If Watson slumps at all Winston will get his shot. Hopefully he’s in an anti Hero-ball offense.

 

[Rexman100]

Pete was not short on smarts and play design, but didn't seem to be an alpha that the players would study and play hard for. Payton backed him up, so he got by without being a strong personality.

Really, a team needs a HC that's the heart of both the offense and defense to prevent poaching of their assistants. No one was going to poach a DA or PC, so we kept them for years, many of which were very successful. The HC needs assistants that are loyal and 100% sold on his coaching philosophy.

You’re only as good as the talent you have. KK chose to come to Nola because of the players. The only team in history that bucked this rule were the “dream team” BBall team from years ago. Bill Belichick was Fired.

 

[Rexman100]

Which is crazy when you think about it. Shows that hype can even get to All-Pro/Pro Bowl players.
If Watson struggled with a 2 time coach of the year, what in the world would he do with Sneaky Pete and Co? lol

It’s not hype it’s truth. Players make plays. Too much emphasis is on coaches. As great of a head coach Belichick was, he consistently proved he could not keep the shelves full. His inventory management skill was that of a kindergarten level.

 

[St.Dan]

I remember it differently. I remember TA holding out until after the air cleared w/ Watson to sign w/ Dolphins. He wanted to know we were getting a QB b4 making a decision.

In fact Watson was traded on March 20, Terron signed w/ Dolphins Mar 22. He was indeed waiting and it confirms what Underhill reported at the time that Armstead would have returned if we’d nabbed Watson

Actually it was Matt Miller

Saints free agent Terron Armstead waiting on Deshaun Watson situation

The NFL world is wondering why we haven't heard much about New Orleans Saints free agent tackle Terron Armstead and now we know why.

whodatdish.com

And we’d have had the same needless drama with Watson as his other team have had. Good thing the Failclowns drove his price up. We didn’t need the guy’s off-field stuff.

 

[ELLIASJWILLIAMS]

And we’d have had the same needless drama with Watson as his other team have had. Good thing the Failclowns drove his price up. We didn’t need the guy’s off-field stuff.

Everything works out the way it's supposed to.

 

[RebSaint]

Pete was not short on smarts and play design, but didn't seem to be an alpha that the players would study and play hard for. Payton backed him up, so he got by without being a strong personality.

What a really, odd take.. What do you mean by "alpha" anyway? Were you in the meeting rooms, practice fields, and on the sidelines during the games? And if being an "alpha" was important in coaching, then maybe Ditka would have worked out for the Saints. Can somebody not be an "alpha" and have a strong personality?

What ultimately matters in coaching is results. The Saints' offense being inconsistent and ineffective is why Pete was fired.

Pete failed because he could not gameplan effectively nor call the plays which allowed the offense to score more points and move the ball consistently--it has nothing to do with his alleged "alpha" personality.

Really, a team needs a HC that's the heart of both the offense and defense to prevent poaching of their assistants. No one was going to poach a DA or PC, so we kept them for years, many of which were very successful. The HC needs assistants that are loyal and 100% sold on his coaching philosophy.

Not really. We've seen where "loyalty" has gotten this franchise in trouble. I would have loved to keep Pete as an offensive assistant; I speculate that because he was not familiar with the Shanahan-Kubiak system, he was let go completely. I think Pete landed right where he would have needed to be most likely if he wanted to continue coaching. Since the Saints are running a different offensive system, there was no place for Pete. It's just speculation, but if the Saints were going to run a version of SP's offense, Pete might still be on the staff with a new OC.

My biggest issue with hiring him in the first place is that he didn't want the job. I would have moved on to the next crop of candidates if he had any misgivings, but maybe DA has finally learned from Payton and so many others that being overly-loyal to assistants is not a recipe for success, esp. when your own performance is under scrutiny.

 

[bobad]

You’re only as good as the talent you have. KK chose to come to Nola because of the players. The only team in history that bucked this rule were the “dream team” BBall team from years ago. Bill Belichick was Fired.

Right, and I don't think anyone was drafted, or any changes made to the offense or defense without it going through Payton. I think he was very controlling on every aspect of the team. DA may give KK the power to run the offense as he sees fit, but I doubt that DA had that privilege.

No complaints, it worked out for the most part. We kept our assistants and very good continuity.

 

[bobad]

What a really, odd take.. What do you mean by "alpha" anyway?

You're putting me on, you know precisely what an alpha is.

I've seen a lot of alphas, and Pete is no alpha. Some people can be an alpha and not be a jack hole, others obviously can't. Pete wasn't controlling his offense last year, the players were making a lot of mistakes that they wouldn't have made under a Payton or other strong coach. I hope KK is a lot stronger leader than Pete (who I really like and respect).